Obama Chooses Joe Biden as VP

[Vampyr]

Somehow McCain is creating this image that he is a down to earth working class citizen himself.

I'm not sure who's buying that. From everything I've read about him and from every time I've heard him speak, he seems to be one of the most out of touch people I've ever seen.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Vampyr

Somehow McCain is creating this image that he is a down to earth working class citizen himself.

I'm not sure who's buying that. From everything I've read about him and from every time I've heard him speak, he seems to be one of the most out of touch people I've ever seen.

Can you give examples?

[Vampyr]

Originally Posted by Professor S

Can you give examples?

First of all, John McCain is immensely wealthy. I don't have any problems with that, I would like to be too, but he downplays that all the time, trying to make himself seem more rugged and blue collared. I mean, all his commercials are calling him the "The original maverick." What does that even mean? Nearly every speech he's given in Kentucky was at a National Rifle Association meeting. That's laughable.

When asked how many houses he owned, he responded "I'll have to have my staff get back to you."

When asked if he thought it was unfair that health insurance companies covered viagra and not birth control, he sat there with a very pained expression on his face for about 15 seconds, before saying, "I don't know enough about that to answer you" or something to that effect.

McCain once stated that there had been great economic growth during the 8 years Bush has been in office, stating there had been "great progress economically over that period of time." I guess someone told him the mistake he made, because on the next day he turned around and said "American's are hurting badly, they're not better off than they were 8 years ago."

I don't think he's in touch with regular people at all. And it's not just those things, it's the way he acts and the things he does. The other day I saw a video of him giving a speech somewhere, and he introduced one of his supporters to talk...some Puerto Rican rapper named Daddy Yankee. I mean, could that be any more obviously an attempt to get what he considers to be the "young and cool" crowd to like him? Maybe if Puerto Ricans could vote it would have been an alright thing to do.

And now his VP pick. Mostly just a ploy to draw in women voters. You complain about Obama's lack of experience all the time, and here McCain chooses someone who has been a governer for two years, not even any experience with the federal government. If McCain dies (and he's getting kind of old, it could happen) would you want her to be our president?

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Vampyr

First of all, John McCain is immensely wealthy. I don't have any problems with that, I would like to be too, but he downplays that all the time, trying to make himself seem more rugged and blue collared. I mean, all his commercials are calling him the "The original maverick." What does that even mean? Nearly every speech he's given in Kentucky was at a National Rifle Association meeting. That's laughable.

Well honestly, in today's day and age being a supporter of the NRA is maverick. Moreover, he has a long history of bucking his own party to achieve goals that he thought were best for the nation, recently pushing for reductions in spending since 2000 and campaign finance reform (even though that turned out to be a bit of a mess).

As for him being rich, well, really his wife is rich and he went along for the ride. he enetred politics pretty much right out of the Hanoi Hilton.

When asked how many houses he owned, he responded "I'll have to have my staff get back to you."

Do you have any other Obama ads you'd like to repeat? Maybe he shiould be compaining about the price of arugula at whiole foods, like Obama did? And in the end, biothg arguments are meaningless. Honestly, who cares who knows owns what? Obama is rich as shit too. So what? That has npothing to do with whether or not someone is in touch.

When asked if he thought it was unfair that health insurance companies covered viagra and not birth control, he sat there with a very pained expression on his face for about 15 seconds, before saying, "I don't know enough about that to answer you" or something to that effect.

The knee jerk Republican reaction reaction would be to go all birth control nazi on the reporter. Instead, he admitted to not knowing something on a subject, which is honorable especially when confronted with a loaded question like that. Moreover, insurance compoanies can cover whatever they like. And consumers can choose accordingly.

McCain once stated that there had been great economic growth during the 8 years Bush has been in office, stating there had been "great progress economically over that period of time." I guess someone told him the mistake he made, because on the next day he turned around and said "American's are hurting badly, they're not better off than they were 8 years ago."

Both statements are correct. There was great economic growth, especially after 9/11 when everything plummeted. Now its taken a downturn, and is not a great as it was one or two years ago or in 2000, which techinically is 8 years ago. 2001? We're MUCH better now.

And I do take exception to the wording in McCain's second statement, as I think he pandered a bit. The economy isn't as bad as everyone would have you believe, and the BBC even reported that it went up over 3% last quarter. The Anmerican idea of success and "poverty" is so skewed by our affluence it's insane. It used to be success was a car in every driveway... now its a car in every three-car garage, a plasma screen TV in every room, and meanwhile the kids in these families are relying on grants and government loans to go to college.

I grew up knowing what it was like to be in a successful and poor family. In the 80's my dad had a successful, but small, construction company. When the recession hit, he barely worked for almost 2 years and struggled just to keep his business afloat. I remember weeks of tuna casserole for lunch and dinner. I also remember steak and eggs for breakfast in years earlier and in the mid-late 90's and my dad being lucky enough in 2001 to have a contractual job with a private school when times got tough again.

Times aren't that tough right now, we're just doing as well as we were before and we have to make adjustments. Its not the democrats or republicans who are responsible... its the economy... its done it before and MUCH worse and it will do it again. And the sky certainly isn't falling and no amount of raised taxes to the rich will help, it will only inspire the rich to hide their money in untaxable trusts and not invest it back in their businesses, which can only hurt.

And in my experience, demonizing business and the rich never made any poor person any richer. Does it make them feel better? Sure, I guess and I find that sad. And it defeinitely gets people elected.

I don't think he's in touch with regular people at all. And it's not just those things, it's the way he acts and the things he does. The other day I saw a video of him giving a speech somewhere, and he introduced one of his supporters to talk...some Puerto Rican rapper named Daddy Yankee. I mean, could that be any more obviously an attempt to get what he considers to be the "young and cool" crowd to like him? Maybe if Puerto Ricans could vote it would have been an alright thing to do.

And Obama doesn't do the same thing? Remember Luda's rap against Hillary? Oh please... both are guilty of this so please don't point it out only when it is politically expedient for your candidate.

And now his VP pick. Mostly just a ploy to draw in women voters. You complain about Obama's lack of experience all the time, and here McCain chooses someone who has been a governer for two years, not even any experience with the federal government. If McCain dies (and he's getting kind of old, it could happen) would you want her to be our president?

Palin was on the short list back when Hillary was still winning the primary, so your pandering point is a non-issue. For this arument? She has a son in the Iraq war and I believe she's the wife of a firefighter. +1 for in-touchness for McCain.

As for her experience, I'll admit I am concerned about it, especially considering McCain's age and her lack of pretty much any international experience. She would not have been my first choice. I always liked the governor of Lousiana, Bobbty Jindal.

[Bond]

Originally Posted by Vampyr

First of all, John McCain is immensely wealthy. I don't have any problems with that, I would like to be too, but he downplays that all the time, trying to make himself seem more rugged and blue collared. I mean, all his commercials are calling him the "The original maverick." What does that even mean? Nearly every speech he's given in Kentucky was at a National Rifle Association meeting. That's laughable.

Just a quick clarification: McCain is not wealthy. His wife inherited a beer bottling company. That's where the money comes from.

Sometimes I wish these threads wouldn't get so lengthy so quickly. It's so hard to jump in after a few pages and reply to everything.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Bond

Just a quick clarification: McCain is not wealthy. His wife inherited a beer bottling company. That's where the money comes from.

Sometimes I wish these threads wouldn't get so lengthy so quickly. It's so hard to jump in after a few pages and reply to everything.

I can be wordy at times... and full of typos... wow...

[Vampyr]

Originally Posted by Bond

Just a quick clarification: McCain is not wealthy. His wife inherited a beer bottling company. That's where the money comes from.

Sometimes I wish these threads wouldn't get so lengthy so quickly. It's so hard to jump in after a few pages and reply to everything.

So if I were to inherit a ton of money, that would make me not wealthy, even though I had...a ton of money?

And this isn't about him having money, it's about about being out of touch with reality because of it.

@Prof S. your post didn't point out a single thing McCain has done or said to prove he -is- in touch with reality, you just pushed my points to the side as "quoting Obama's ads", and said McCain was admirable.

I fail to see how him not being able to answer the simple question of "do you think this is right or wrong" makes him admirable. I think it makes him crooked.

And yeah, I could quote some Obama ads, like the one that has John McCain saying "Our economy isn't headed to a recession", but I know -that- one was taken out of context, his house comment was not.

And I'm sure McCain though "Well, if you taken into consideration that everything got REALLY bad after 9/11, then greatly improved, and if I word things just right, I can say that the economy improved." Seriously Professor, you're amazing with facts, but I think you're terrible at reading peoples intentions.

And the difference? Obama can actually pull of being cool, and everyone knows who Ludacris is. No one knows who Daddy Yankee is. They may be doing the same thing, but McCain is obvious that he isn't really comfortable in the situation, and he's just doing it because some campaign manager said it was a good idea.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Vampyr

So if I were to inherit a ton of money, that would make me not wealthy, even though I had...a ton of money?

And this isn't about him having money, it's about about being out of touch with reality because of it.

@Prof S. your post didn't point out a single thing McCain has done or said to prove he -is- in touch with reality, you just pushed my points to the side as "quoting Obama's ads", and said McCain was admirable.

No, my comments were to show you how your eviudence for his being out of touch are pretty erediculous. Happening to be rich and have houses isn't proof that anyone is out of touch. About the source of his wealth, there is a big difference in formative experience between someone who grows up with ealth and someone who grew up an army brat, spent five years as a POW and nearly 30 serving his nation, most of the time relying only on his salary as a Senator.

I fail to see how him not being able to answer the simple question of "do you think this is right or wrong" makes him admirable. I think it makes him crooked.

No, it doesn't. The question was crooked, silly and not justified by any background. If your asked a question when the questions assumes facts that you don't know are correct, why would you answer it? What context is being omitted in this obviously biased question?

And yeah, I could quote some Obama ads, like the one that has John McCain saying "Our economy isn't headed to a recession", but I know -that- one was taken out of context, his house comment was not.

Our ecomomy isn't headed into a recession. Its had positive growth every quarter for as long as I can remember and went up over 3% last querter. if you think that means we're headed towards a recession, you don't know what a recession is.

And I'm sure McCain though "Well, if you taken into consideration that everything got REALLY bad after 9/11, then greatly improved, and if I word things just right, I can say that the economy improved." Seriously Professor, you're amazing with facts, but I think you're terrible at reading peoples intentions.

And I think you take things the way you want to view them. I already stated my issue with McCain's second statement was that he pandered. No question about it. He should have stuck to his guns and made the bold and risky statement of truth, and thats the fact that we're not in a recession, we are doing better that we were in the early 2000's instead of quibbling over whether it was 2000 or 2001. The economy was terrible all through the early00's and the fact is we ARE doing much better today even during our slow down.

And the difference? Obama can actually pull of being cool, and everyone knows who Ludacris is. No one knows who Daddy Yankee is. They may be doing the same thing, but McCain is obvious that he isn't really comfortable in the situation, and he's just doing it because some campaign manager said it was a good idea.

Well I'm glad Obama can pull off being cool. I suppose you can excuse someone for panswering when they "pull it off" but not when they can't? Thats like saying its ok to steal if you get away with it.

Opinions olike this only show complete bias. Its ok for one candidate and not for the other because you like one and not the other... good for you.

I wish both candidates wouldn't do it. Its insulting but unfortunately deemed necessary in today's political climate.

[Professor S]

I wanted to edit out the insuting comment at the end of my post, but for some reason I can't edit it. I apolgize for the insulting tone, I just don't understand how you can overlook pandering by one candidate, yet condemn the other for the same thing.

[TheGame]

Prof S you're being overly defensive about Mccain in my opinion. You're a good example of someone who's completly sold, I doubt there's anything that'll change your mind in the next few months.

Like I said earlier in the thread though, I'm in a situation where I see very few people who actually support John Mccain. I've heard the speeches, and have been following Mccain for a long time... But honestly, I've probably watched it from biased sources with a biased mindset, but at this point I can't think of any good reason why I'd want to vote for Mccain.

So to clarify your stance, why do you think Mccain should be our next president? If possible, leave comparisions to Obama out of it and mud slinging. Just look at Mccain for himself and what he is and what he stands for. Why would you vote for him? What does he bring to the table that you know from history would make him the most suitable for this job?

I guess side questions could be be, are you a supporter of what bush has done in the last 8 years? If so, what would you say Mccain is carrying on from bush that you like? If not, what things do you think Mccain is going to change?

I'm conserative, but I prefer not to define myself by a party. Since defining myself like that implies I would vote with them no matter what.