State of Israel

mickydaniels · 09-04-2003, 04:34 PM

It's actually from 1964, the same year he went to Mecca. Before or after I don't know. 1965 is the year this was printed. Doesn't really matter because he was still against oppression, he just accepted the fact that maybe blacks couldn't do it all on their own.

Professor S · 09-04-2003, 07:16 PM

Well thw whole idea of gaining acceptance through isolationist views is pretty silly. I liked his views after his trip to Mecca, but before he was more than a little suspect.

mickydaniels · 09-05-2003, 01:10 PM

More than a little suspect? Please explain.

And how is gaining accpetance through isolation silly? That's the same thing Israel is doing. They don't want any Palestinians so they're doing what they feel is necessary to keep them out even though the Palestinians were already there.

In any case the state of Israel wouldn't exist today if it wasn't for the Holocaust. It was obvious they were not going to stay in Europe and the US simply didn't want to deal with mass Jewish immigration. They set up Israel and made everyone happy.

Rick_Blaze · 09-05-2003, 01:18 PM

Israel kills Palestinians and it means nothing. Palestinians retaliate and they're so evil. They don't want suicide bombs just give the Palestinians the state they deserve, and dismantle every single settlement in the west bank. If black people in this country waited for white terrorists in the south to stop violence, then they're might still have been segregation in this country. There are about 3.8 million Palestinian refugees. 3.8 that have been kicked out of their country and still can't return.

Professor S · 09-05-2003, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick_Blaze

Israel kills Palestinians and it means nothing. Palestinians retaliate and they're so evil. They don't want suicide bombs just give the Palestinians the state they deserve, and dismantle every single settlement in the west bank. If black people in this country waited for white terrorists in the south to stop violence, then they're might still have been segregation in this country. There are about 3.8 million Palestinian refugees. 3.8 that have been kicked out of their country and still can't return.

There are so many things wrong with your atatements I don't know where to begin.

Israel - You kind of have it reversed. The violence did not start from Israel, but they sure do know how to finish it. Israel even gave land back, and Palestinians used it to further their terrorist attacks. We are going to have to face the truth that those that are extreme enough to be suicide bombers do not want a compromise. They want all of Israel, and Israel ain't going anywhere. The end result? The violence will continue and there will be no end.

Also, Palestine isn't even a country. It never has been.

Civil Rights - Yes, black leaders had a lot to do with the revolution that too place in the 60's, but do you really think anything would have happened if sympathetic and influential white people hadn't helped? Nope. Plus there were many black people back then and even today who are fans of "separate but equal".

The world isn't as black and white as some would like to believe. Israel isn't evil and Palestinians aren't good, or vice versa. There are many shades of gray in between that confuse the issue until you realize that there is no simple solution to this, and there might never be.

mickydaniels · 09-06-2003, 12:21 PM

1. The violence did not start from Israel.
--- Really? They came in, declared their homeland where people were already living, and they were just supposed to sit back and let it happen? I have never heard of that pacifism anywhere at any time.

2. The violence will continue and there will be no end.
--- That's obvious. That's what you get when you get 2 stubborn groups and they both have 'divine favor' on their side.

3. Israel attacks specific targets while Palestinian terrorists blow up cars in streets filled with innocents. There is no comparison.
--- A life lost is a life lost. Plus, there have been numerous UN resolutions against Israel for fighting dirty. When you believe you will be delivered, there is no need to play by any rules.

As for racism with Malcolm X, if things aren't working, a new vision is needed. He simply provided new ideas. I mean, when the Constition makes you an equal citizen by 1870, shouldn't you be treated like one then and there? And even if it takes some time, should it take nearly 100 years so that it at least looks like it?

GiMpY-wAnNaBe · 09-06-2003, 03:57 PM

i may be wrong but 90% of all the for and against arguments are based on religion. Strangler is completely right when he stated that religion does much more harm than good in cases like these. Its one world, and scriptures from a thousand years ago is not gonna help today. i personally believe that both sides are victims of hate and prejudice. And i HATE people who say that ALL Jews are retards and violent people, or ALL Palastinians smell bad and will do anything to corrupt the world. The truth is that there are good people and assholes on each side, and each one can justify their actions in their own rights. Just how Hitler, although everyone hates him for his crimes, in his mind he was doing what he saw as best for his country. I by no means am justifying his attempts at genocide and various other crimes but try to encourage to see this war from the other point of view rather than just hate them for not agreeing with you.

Professor S · 09-05-2003, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickydaniels

More than a little suspect? Please explain.

Your the fan of Malcolm X, you should know. Before he went on his trip to Mecca his views were far more extreme and violent, and many would even say racist. That I consider suspect.

Quote:

And how is gaining accpetance through isolation silly? That's the same thing Israel is doing. They don't want any Palestinians so they're doing what they feel is necessary to keep them out even though the Palestinians were already there.

It comes down to safety. The Palestinians that they have allowed to live in their country are at best hostile and at worst actively participating in terrorism. We in America become outraged when ONE TERRORIST ACT is perpetrated on us. Imagine being Israeli and living with it on a daily basis.

And why is there even a comparison? Israel attacks specific targets while Palestinian terrorists blow up cars in busy streets filled with innocents. There is no comparison.

Quote:

In any case the state of Israel wouldn't exist today if it wasn't for the Holocaust. It was obvious they were not going to stay in Europe and the US simply didn't want to deal with mass Jewish immigration. They set up Israel and made everyone happy.

Many of the Jews who were in Israel at the time of Patriation were already there. Patriation began back during WWI and there were large Jewish populations before then. Many more came after the war, its true, but basically the UN drew lines that already existed. Its not like the UN just said "ok, everybody out, you Jews step right in."