State of Israel

[mickydaniels]

Originally Posted by The Strangler

I don't know about Malcolm X as I never studied him, but I know many of his followers are very much anti-semites. I do know that Malcolm X for much of his political life considered pretty much everyone who wasn't black a devil.

Here's a statement I believe accurately describes what he was about from 1965:

Whether you're educated or illiterate, whether you live on the boulevard or in the alley, you're going to catch hell just like I am. We're all in the same boat and we all are going to catch the same hell from the same man. He just happens to be a white man. All of us have suffered here, in this country, political oppression at the hands of the white man, and social degradation at the hands of the white man.
Now in speaking like this, it doesn't mean that we're anti-white, but it does mean we're anti-exploitation, we're anti-degradation, we're anti-oppression. And if the white man doesn't want us to be anti-him, let him stop oppressing us and exploiting and degrading us.

[Professor S]

Was that quote from before or after his pilgrimmage to Mecca? I know his views changed greatly after his pilgrimmage.

[mickydaniels]

It's actually from 1964, the same year he went to Mecca. Before or after I don't know. 1965 is the year this was printed. Doesn't really matter because he was still against oppression, he just accepted the fact that maybe blacks couldn't do it all on their own.

[Professor S]

Well thw whole idea of gaining acceptance through isolationist views is pretty silly. I liked his views after his trip to Mecca, but before he was more than a little suspect.

[mickydaniels]

More than a little suspect? Please explain.


And how is gaining accpetance through isolation silly? That's the same thing Israel is doing. They don't want any Palestinians so they're doing what they feel is necessary to keep them out even though the Palestinians were already there.

In any case the state of Israel wouldn't exist today if it wasn't for the Holocaust. It was obvious they were not going to stay in Europe and the US simply didn't want to deal with mass Jewish immigration. They set up Israel and made everyone happy.

[Rick_Blaze]

Israel kills Palestinians and it means nothing. Palestinians retaliate and they're so evil. They don't want suicide bombs just give the Palestinians the state they deserve, and dismantle every single settlement in the west bank. If black people in this country waited for white terrorists in the south to stop violence, then they're might still have been segregation in this country. There are about 3.8 million Palestinian refugees. 3.8 that have been kicked out of their country and still can't return.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by Rick_Blaze

Israel kills Palestinians and it means nothing. Palestinians retaliate and they're so evil. They don't want suicide bombs just give the Palestinians the state they deserve, and dismantle every single settlement in the west bank. If black people in this country waited for white terrorists in the south to stop violence, then they're might still have been segregation in this country. There are about 3.8 million Palestinian refugees. 3.8 that have been kicked out of their country and still can't return.

There are so many things wrong with your atatements I don't know where to begin.

Israel - You kind of have it reversed. The violence did not start from Israel, but they sure do know how to finish it. Israel even gave land back, and Palestinians used it to further their terrorist attacks. We are going to have to face the truth that those that are extreme enough to be suicide bombers do not want a compromise. They want all of Israel, and Israel ain't going anywhere. The end result? The violence will continue and there will be no end.

Also, Palestine isn't even a country. It never has been.

Civil Rights - Yes, black leaders had a lot to do with the revolution that too place in the 60's, but do you really think anything would have happened if sympathetic and influential white people hadn't helped? Nope. Plus there were many black people back then and even today who are fans of "separate but equal".

The world isn't as black and white as some would like to believe. Israel isn't evil and Palestinians aren't good, or vice versa. There are many shades of gray in between that confuse the issue until you realize that there is no simple solution to this, and there might never be.

[Professor S]

Originally Posted by mickydaniels

More than a little suspect? Please explain.

Your the fan of Malcolm X, you should know. Before he went on his trip to Mecca his views were far more extreme and violent, and many would even say racist. That I consider suspect.

And how is gaining accpetance through isolation silly? That's the same thing Israel is doing. They don't want any Palestinians so they're doing what they feel is necessary to keep them out even though the Palestinians were already there.

It comes down to safety. The Palestinians that they have allowed to live in their country are at best hostile and at worst actively participating in terrorism. We in America become outraged when ONE TERRORIST ACT is perpetrated on us. Imagine being Israeli and living with it on a daily basis.

And why is there even a comparison? Israel attacks specific targets while Palestinian terrorists blow up cars in busy streets filled with innocents. There is no comparison.

In any case the state of Israel wouldn't exist today if it wasn't for the Holocaust. It was obvious they were not going to stay in Europe and the US simply didn't want to deal with mass Jewish immigration. They set up Israel and made everyone happy.

Many of the Jews who were in Israel at the time of Patriation were already there. Patriation began back during WWI and there were large Jewish populations before then. Many more came after the war, its true, but basically the UN drew lines that already existed. Its not like the UN just said "ok, everybody out, you Jews step right in."