Thoughts on the death penalty? - Page 2

KillerGremlin · 07-08-2009, 11:27 AM

Wow, 8 against and 5 for. That's about 38% of voters who support the death penalty so far, not to shabby. I'm not trying to single anyone out but I'm curious who voted for "Yes" and if they are serious and why they support the death penalty.

TheGame · 07-08-2009, 12:02 PM

I support the death penalty under certain circumstances. But I think how its handled in most cases now is broken.

Teuthida · 07-08-2009, 01:36 PM

If there's a serial killer who enjoys daily ass rape then sure, kill em.

KillerGremlin · 07-10-2009, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teuthida

If there's a serial killer who enjoys daily ass rape then sure, kill em.

Enjoys receiving or giving?

In all seriousness though, that's not being very empathetic. =/

Teuthida · 07-10-2009, 01:34 PM

A one off murder I wouldn't give the death penalty as a sentence. A serial killer with no remorse who just keeps killing shouldn't be allowed to live. I just threw in the rape part jokingly because a lifelong sentence wouldn't be so bad for him if he enjoyed the benefits of prison.

KillerGremlin · 07-10-2009, 10:14 PM

Even if a serial killer had no remorse, I wouldn't feel confident deciding if he has the right to live.

Perhaps neurotic/psychotic/anti-social tendencies are inborn. Or maybe serial killers were beat or abused as young children. I would support solitary confinement. The US prison system is bullshit. We send way too many people to prison for small drug chargers and minor offenses. We really should just make these people do community service. We could lower the prison costs and get rid of death row and keep the real killers incarcerated for life.

I'm also for getting rid of parole, especially for serial killers or first degree murder that was clearly intentional.

Teuthida · 07-10-2009, 10:31 PM

See that's another reason I suggested the death penalty. I dunno if it's just me, but if I were to be sent to prison I'd much much prefer solitary confinement. Although if this hypothetical killer would just attack other inmates I suppose solitary confinement would be best if you don't want him killed. Some people just deserve to die...but I see how it can get hazy as a government sanctioned death. We need another Australia to sent convicts to. Mars?

You're right about prison for the small drug chargers. As far as the US prison compares to the rest of the world, I don't know enough about other countries' prisons. I know in a lot of Asian countries marijuana is a much bigger offense than it is here for example.

KillerGremlin · 07-11-2009, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teuthida

See that's another reason I suggested the death penalty. I dunno if it's just me, but if I were to be sent to prison I'd much much prefer solitary confinement.

I like people too much, I would go nuts in solitary confinement. On the other hand, I watched a documentary about prison and the amount of fighting and stuff is pretty crazy. The high security prisons for top-tier criminals are crazy places.

I hope some day in the future we have a better way to store prisoners. Maybe we will even have robot guards and a couple of head humans watching over the place.

If I had the choice of Death Penalty vs. Solitary Confinement or many years getting assraped in a dirty facility while eating shitty food....I dunno, I'd probably go with the first to be honest. =/ That's my rational for not zapping these guys, let them think about their crimes while taking it up the butt.

Jason1 · 07-13-2009, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bond

Legally, it should be left to individual states to decide.

Uh, correct me if im wrong, but isnt it currently up to the states to decided? Maybe it was just the wording, but the way you said that makes it sound like it SHOULD be up to the states to decide, like it is not that way currently.

Personally I dont have a big problem with the death penalty, I think some people dont deserve to live. That may sound harsh but its what I believe, some people are just that terrible.

Professor S · 07-13-2009, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason1

Uh, correct me if im wrong, but isnt it currently up to the states to decided? Maybe it was just the wording, but the way you said that makes it sound like it SHOULD be up to the states to decide, like it is not that way currently.

It should and is decided by the states. The conversation was more universal in context, and I think Bond wanted to emphasize that this decision is a very subjective one that should be made by communities, not nations. I think this should be the case with most subjective/social issues (death penalty, smoking in public places, abortion, etc.)

Quote:

Personally I dont have a big problem with the death penalty, I think some people dont deserve to live. That may sound harsh but its what I believe, some people are just that terrible.

So makes that decision? Would you feel comfortable sentencing someone to death? What if they were innocent and you never found out until after they were killed?

TheGame · 07-13-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Professor S

So makes that decision? Would you feel comfortable sentencing someone to death? What if they were innocent and you never found out until after they were killed?

Yeah that question is the problem with it in the first place.. there needs to be some dramatic overwhelming evidence for the death penalty to be valid. Lets take the opposite situation..

Think of someone you love who is under the age of 18 (boy or girl), and lets say that there is video evidence of a man on trial brutaly raping the kid then killing them, and then selling the videos over the internet and making money off of it. And in the courtroom they are 100% unremorseful for it, and claims they enjoyed it and would do it again if they had the chance. Would you feel like that guy deserves a chance at life?

What would you consider a fitting penalty for that?

Dylflon · 07-13-2009, 01:28 PM

In the future, death row convicts will fight in gladiator arenas for our amusement.

Go ahead. Quote me on that.

Professor S · 07-13-2009, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGame

Yeah that question is the problem with it in the first place.. there needs to be some dramatic overwhelming evidence for the death penalty to be valid. Lets take the opposite situation..

Think of someone you love who is under the age of 18 (boy or girl), and lets say that there is video evidence of a man on trial brutaly raping the kid then killing them, and then selling the videos over the internet and making money off of it. And in the courtroom they are 100% unremorseful for it, and claims they enjoyed it and would do it again if they had the chance. Would you feel like that guy deserves a chance at life?

What would you consider a fitting penalty for that?

Maximum security prison for life with no chance of parole. The question isn't about punishment, but about the value of human life and who gets to make those decisions. I don't think we get t make those decisions unless we are trying to save our life or others. If prison can fit that need just as well, we should use it. Besides, prison is NOT pleasant and I would consider a life term a fate worse than death, honestly.

Also, the main reasoning behind the death penalty isn't that it is appropriate punishment, but that it is a deterrent. Maybe it used to be a deterrent, but it's so behind closed doors now that it's almost mythic in character. If it were made public, perhaps it would deter, but then we'd have something more abhorrent than I'd like to comprehend.

You don't have to kill someone to take their life. A lifetime of hard labor can be punsihment enough. Keep in mind, I'm also for alternative punishments as well. Say, if a child molester elects to castrate himself for parole, I'm all for it. The goal should be to correct and/or prevent behavior, not to apply vengeance.

TheGame · 07-13-2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Professor S

Maximum security prison for life with no chance of parole. The question isn't about punishment, but about the value of human life and who gets to make those decisions. I don't think we get t make those decisions unless we are trying to save our life or others. If prison can fit that need just as well, we should use it. Besides, prison is NOT pleasant and I would consider a life term a fate worse than death, honestly.

I would disagree completly. You can't honestly say that you'd chose to die over sitting in a cell for the rest of yor life getting free (and instant) medical care, free food, and still being able to socialize. (You'd even get to see your wife/kids again, isn't that enough worth living for?) Now if the prisons were actually tougher by nature, and were a form of torture in a way... then I could see how someone would chose to die. But these days you still have a life, even behind bars.

Quote:

You don't have to kill someone to take their life. A lifetime of hard labor can be punsihment enough. Keep in mind, I'm also for alternative punishments as well. Say, if a child molester elects to castrate himself for parole, I'm all for it. The goal should be to correct and/or prevent behavior, not to apply vengeance.

I disagree, if you let a person like that go no matter what they did, its a huge risk of the family of the victim taking things into their own hands. If you take the example from my previous post (and I'm talking REALLY taking it into consideration), and the guy castrated himself to get out on parole, and you met them in a store face to face knowing what they did without a doubt...

Well, lets just say that's one of those situations where human's "animal nature" comes out. You're not going to be able to think straight, trust me.

Here's what I think the problems are:
1) The death penalty has been given to people who are innocent.
2) The alternative to death (going to prison) is not harsh enough punishment for some crimes.

Here's what I think the solutions would be:
1) Death penalty should only be reserved for crimes that are public displays, and that are caught on tape. And when its sentanced it should hapen quickly, instead of allowing the govt to waste tons of money on keeping them on death row.
2) If someone is found guilty of a crime that gives them a life sentance.. we should have much harder prisons that are harsh enough to give the prisoner the illusion that they're dead. No visitation, no TV, no reading, no socializing, just a bed, 4 walls, and 3 meals. No parole, either.
3) IF someone is found guilty and sentanced to a life sentance and they're eventually found to be innocent of the crime. The government should provide some type of aide to the prisoner for the rest of their life because this occurance is the result of a broken judgement system.

That's just my opinions on it. I value human life just as much as the next guy, but some people do deserve to die.

Professor S · 07-13-2009, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGame

I would disagree completly. You can't honestly say that you'd chose to die over sitting in a cell for the rest of yor life getting free (and instant) medical care, free food, and still being able to socialize. (You'd even get to see your wife/kids again, isn't that enough worth living for?) Now if the prisons were actually tougher by nature, and were a form of torture in a way... then I could see how someone would chose to die. But these days you still have a life, even behind bars.

I think your view of prison is a bit rose colored. I'd rather not have to join a racial gang to avoid being sexually abused and/or traded around by other inmates, worrying about whether or not I'm going to get beat up, raped or stabbed on any given day. I'd rather not go though the mental torment of watching my family's utter and complete shame in me and then watch as they grow more distant and finally (hopefully) disappear.

I guess in the end, the death penalty has proven itself to have zero effect as a deterrent (violent crime and murder rates have risen over time and use of the death penalty), so what is the point of the action? Once again, you can have someone put away for life with the same effect (he/she never commits the crime again). Anything else is a grotesque vengeance fantasy, IMO, and one where mistakes can and will be made.