North Korea Missile Fails After 35 Seconds

[Typhoid]

Originally Posted by Bond

The one Taepodong-2 missile that failed 35 seconds after launch could carry a nuclear payload.

So can a car?

Semantics.

[MrCoffee]

cars cant fly through the hair and hit a target completely bypassing rush hour...unless you have a freakishly tricked out car...

[Typhoid]

Originally Posted by MrCoffee

cars cant fly through the hair and hit a target completely bypassing rush hour...unless you have a freakishly tricked out car...

I can put a nuke in my car and drive it into a building in Seattle.

[Professor S]

I just finsihed reading much of this thread... and I have nothing to say. I am dumbfounded by some of the opinions shared here. Whether its a lack of those that are old enough to remember when the world was really in danger for 50+ years during the cold war or just plain apathetic cynicism I don't know.

1) Kim's a nutjob commu-facist
2) He kills his own people and cares less about everyone else
3) He has nukes
4) He's testing a missile that can deliver them half way around the world

What about this situation isn't frightening?


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke

"The evil of the world is made possible by nothing but the sanction you give it." - Ayn Rand

"The spread of evil is the symptom of a vacuum. whenever evil wins, it is only by default: by the moral failure of those who evade the fact that there can be no compromise on basic principles." - Ayn Rand

[Fox 6]

Originally Posted by Professor S

1) Kim's a nutjob commu-facist
[/i]

I just have to say something to correct your statement. Its nothing arguing against Kim's brutality. It's just by definition facists are anti-communist. The both ideologies couldn't be more opposite, the hate each other. Sorry to be anal but I couldnt help myself.

[Jonbo298]

Kim isn't threatening my life personally since I dont live on the West Coast which is what he's more likely to strike first since...its gonna be nigh impossible to get a missile from North Korea to NYC without the US stopping it.

So...yeah. While he is a crazy nutjob, I don't see him launching a Nuke at Nebraska or Iowa anytime soon. Hopefully if one is thrown at the US that the radiation doesn't reach that far over..

[Xantar]

Originally Posted by Fox 6

I just have to say something to correct your statement. Its nothing arguing against Kim's brutality. It's just by definition facists are anti-communist. The both ideologies couldn't be more opposite, the hate each other. Sorry to be anal but I couldnt help myself.

I actually think Strangler's termis quite apt particularly since Kim Jong Il is very much not a communist. Say what you will about the ideology, but a real communist would actually care for the plight of the people. Kim Jong Il is more like a fascist who styles himself as a communist, and if Marx is aware of this, he would probably spin in his grave so fast he'd develop his own field of gravity.

Anyway, imagine you are Kim Jong Il for a moment:

- Your country's economy is basically non-existent. You don't even have enough food to feed your population.

- Your army is pretty big and somewhat modern. But it basically is no match for anybody else. If you pissed off the United States or Europe or even Japan, you would find your ass firmly kicked out of office within three months.

- Time and history are not on the side of your government. If you just stay put where you are, the rest of the world will just send you food aid from time to time and basically wait for you to die or be deposed or assassinated. Every other communist government in the world has had to open up at least a little bit, but in your case, your population has been treated so badly that once they catch a glimpse of freedom and what life on the outside can be like, they'll probably force reform.

- You have NO friends. China is theoretically your ally, but if it came down to a choice between you or the rest of the world, they'd side with the latter in a heartbeat.

- You are a potential nuclear power which is the only thing that scares anybody.

So what do you do? You play your one and only card for what it's worth. Kim Jong Il is basically pulling the equivalent of, "Hey, look at me! Over here! I'm about to use a nuke. Really, I have one! Or I'm trying to get one! Now give me what I want!"

Of course North Korea is dangerous, but we should also be aware that it's in their best interest to grandstand as much as possible because otherwise they will have absolutely no influence in the world and no way to get economic and nutritional aid. I don't know how aware Kim Jong Il is of his country's situation, but they need that foreign aid to survive or else the whole country would basically die.

[Neo]

He has a few more cards than that. For example, they have numerous long-range artillery spread over the country which could easily take out Seole. It would be impossible for us to take out every single one. If hostilities start with North Korea the first thing they're going to do is kill a bunch of Americans in Seole. Additionally they have miles of tunnels near the border that are wide enough to drive tanks through. Sure we could defeat them easily, but we will not be able to prevent them from doing some serious damage.

[Fox 6]

Originally Posted by Xantar

I actually think Strangler's termis quite apt particularly since Kim Jong Il is very much not a communist. Say what you will about the ideology, but a real communist would actually care for the plight of the people. Kim Jong Il is more like a fascist who styles himself as a communist, and if Marx is aware of this, he would probably spin in his grave so fast he'd develop his own field of gravity.

Indeed.
So did Stalin care about his people? Did Mao care about his people? The answer is hell no and we still call them communists.


Has any major communist government really cared about the plight of their people? USSR? Nope. China? Nope. Both Cuba and Vietnam have been accused of human rights violations. The only countries that might have been friendly towards the poeople are the eastern bloc countries that were forced into communism. For example Poland, Hungary, and Czechoslovakia all tried to distance themselves and faced soviet reprisals.

I see one example of a country that had the peoples best interest at heart. Yugoslavia. Joesef Bros Tito was a commy-partisan and fought the Nazis and liberated his country without Red army support. With this action he earned the peoples support and ultimately became the leader. He refused to join in the Soviet satellite states and there was nothing the Soviets could do because he controlled the masses.


To be fair none of the major communist governments are truly communist. Communism is about eqality. Well we can clearly see that in places like China and the former USSR that eqaulity was not present. We also see these governments institue some capitalistc economic policies such as Deng Xiaoping's special economic zones for a free market economy. We also see a countires change the ideology alltogether. Communism is about world revolution, and thats a policy that Lenin followed closely, but after Stalin came to power he realized he could not acomplish that goal so he opted for "Socialism in one country."

And you can't call him a facist who styles himself as a communist. The two by definition are opposites.They're Mortal enemies. Thats like calling a pear an eggplant. The term commy-facist is and oxy-moron. He's more of a Totalitarion-militaristic-dictator thats a little funny in the head that happens to be in charge of a so called "communist" government.

[Dylflon]

Originally Posted by Typhoid

So can a car?

Semantics.

'm sorry man, but you're the king of semantics.

[Typhoid]

Originally Posted by Dylflon

'm sorry man, but you're the king of semantics.

Thats sort of why I said it.


*coughilovehowyou'retheonetosaysomethingaboutitandnobodyelsecough*