Equality? Heh...

[BlueFire]

http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/788120.asp?cp1=1

http://www.msnbc.com/d/v/250x190/jn_rapmusic_020730.jpg

For people with broadband, check out the video.

Basically, Rev. Paul Scott is working to make Hip-Hop/Rap exclusive to blacks, but I doubt that'll happen. One reason is the first amendment. The rapper, Coolio, is against Scott's views. Mr. Scott seems to be using Malcolm X as a backup a lot (Malcolm X before his conversion to Islam). While I can care less about rap (:p), I think this is a pretty sad crusade that Paul Scott is on.

What do you guys think?

[GameMaster]

I think it's pretty stupid myself. What did Malcom X do that Mr. Scott uses to support his idea. What's Coolio up to these days? Is he still making music? I love "Gangster's Paradise."

[BlueFire]

Well, according to that video, it says he should have a new album this October.

[GameMaster]

Can someone give me a little background on Malcom X so I can understand how Mr. Scott uses him in his supporting idea? Sorry BlueFire, I don't have cable anymore so I'm only limited to those who have watched it.

[DeathsHand]

Sounds pretty stupid to me :unsure:

He's probably is just like "THE BLACK COMMUNITY HAS BEEN ROBBED OF ONE OF OUR GREATEST (not ;) ) THINGS BY WHITE BOYS LIKE EMINEM WHO COME IN HERE AND SELL A BILLION RECORDS! EXCLUSIVE THE BLACKS! IT'S OURS! ALL OURS!"

..... :sneaky:

Seriously though, how could you make a form of music exclusive to blacks? :hmm:

It seems like some people go overboard with the whole... black... issue... They get these special little dates and celebrations and stuff, and then like one little thing happens and people scream "RACISM!" :rolleyes:

meh... wuteva...

[BlueFire]

http://search.biography.com/print_record.pl?id=17275



This might help you.

Edit: Hey really didn't use Malcolm X as a backup, but he brought up a few of his quotes.

[The Germanator]

So...if I sit down and right a rhyme right now and rap it...it would be illegal. Ridiculous. Heh, I could just call it "poetry to a beat". Who does this guy think he is? That's like saying only white people can use light bulbs becasue a white man invented it (well, maybe not exactly the same, but you get the point). Dumb, dumb, dumb...now I know why I sometimes feel like I have social anxiety disorder, because so many people are dumb!

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Ahh, black people. Can't live with them... Can't live... with them...

Considering the only rap I like is from Eminem, they can suck a dick.

[Shadow Fox]

*walks into GT*

*enters thread*

*unsheathes memory*

*unsheathes...[what's that again? Oh yeah]- katana*

*waves to Saffire and Killaine*Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo
Ahh, black people. Can't live with them... Can't live... with them...

Considering the only rap I like is from Eminem, they can suck a dick. And why is it that you like Eminem's rap ONLY? Find three good reasons for that, then I'll commend you-as well as prove something more in the process...standby.

Saffire brought this subject to my attention, and in fact, there are some interesting points brought up by all three parties (journalist, Coolio, and Scott) regarding the issue.

For one, Rev. Paul Scott is correct in the way that the first ammendment is "bended" to cater to the Americans of caucasian descent- think of how long rap was banned in many states because its GENERAL (not wholistic image), promoted violence, drugs and sex...while, well- do I even need to mention Ozzy Osborne, Aerosmith or Marylin Manson's lyrics?

There was even one point where the Million Man March was going to be stopped for fear of "deviant activity", when in actuality, any Woodstock or Spring Break concert could be ten times worse with tons of wild kids with no shirts and an assload of beer and whatnot. There is a difference.

The other point is that rap was created and intended to be used for black people to express themselves fully across rhythmic beats and snares about life's trials and tribulation-thus the term "hip-hop culture". Money and mainstream media has, if not destroyed, totally crippled the stance and reason hip-hop stands as an artform- so why not add whatever you want to it now?

Those were about the only valid points Scott made in regards to this; seeing that he knows little to nothing about the entertainment industry (let alone the rap/hip-hop industry) as a whole.

The reporter (I forget his name), made up another interesting point- Eminem taunts the very reason why Scott should want rap banned from whites. Eminem speaks of how he's "the worst thing since Elvis Presley" (for the uneducated, "Rock and Roll" was taken from Jazz/Blues artforms, also founded by black slaves of the old south as motivational tools). He even speaks of how he "uses rap music rather selfishly" and "used it to get himself wealthy".

While I myself am a fan of Eminem as an artist (the fact that he bars the very buyers of his music through metaphors and blinds the average mind with a catch-phrase to conceal the message is very clever indeed-nwoChris happens to be one of those buyers ;) ), I do feel that Eminem needs to hold his toungue a tad (especially if there would be worldwide panic if say, Nelly started speaking in his same method), and that he does get a little too much favortism and is bending the genre. Since when does a rapper get on the cover of Rolling Stone Magazine? Hmmm...:rolleyes: And last I checked, there isn't a bit of "rock" on any album he's done (underground or mainstream), yet groups like Outkast and Goodie Mob have tons of rock samples or full songs, and get overlooked- maybe it's because they convey a strong, positive message, and not just "let the bodies hit the floor" over and over again, but eh...:rolleyes:

Finally, Coolio is DEFINATELY correct about the role of white America and rap music- it would not exist without the constant support (and finance tracking/publishing deals) given through the money wad that wealthy blacks (at that point in time) were too "afraid" to invest with. As far as white artists "taking away" from the industry, I doubt that will happen anytime soon. Even if it did, it's sure to make things interesting...Hell, look at football, baseball, basketball, and even golf and tennis now....alot more competitive than it once was in the "Jim Crow" assisted South and Northern United States in the days of old.

While I do agree that the first ammendment does warrant freedom of speech across all race/genders, that has not ALWAYS been the case, even as of recent. I honestly do believe if the power of Congress was primarily in the hands of a race other than caucasian ethnicity, alot more freedom in music as a whole would be assessed across the entire racial spectrum.

But then again, that's just IMO, so sue me.;)

-......????

[gekko]

For one, did that fake Rev. dude look a lot like Penguin, or am I just seeing things? And my god was he a dumbass.

And then Coolio tells him he's a fool. I LOVE IT!

[Bond]

Being a Rev. is basically a joke now. You can easily buy that title.

[Yoda9864]

Originally posted by Bond
Being a Rev. is basically a joke now. You can easily buy that title.
Lol, it's so true. Yeah, this is pretty sad.

IMO, I think country should be exclusive to whites...:rolleyes:

[Revival]

This is so gay, they want rap music to be exclusive to blacks? I'm surprised someone hasn't brought up the point of segregation again. Seriously, who gives a f**k? If you want to be a rapper, and you can make it, that's fine -- do whatever the hell you want. Yoda brings up a good point with Country music for whites only -- try to limit this and everything else will have restricitons on it.

R&B can only be for blacks
Rap can only be for blacks
Country can only be for whites
Heavy metal can only be for whites

I mean, how far is this crap going to go? Stop trying to seperate every goddamn thing in this country. Let people do what they want, if you're white, and you want to be a rapper -- fine. Let the public decide if you're popular. I think these artists are making a huge stink because they ain't getting the airplay they want because of other artists (such as Enimem). Sorry to say, but you don't control if you're popular -- the public does, and if the public likes Enimem over your ass, then that's life -- f**king deal with it.

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Originally posted by Shadow Fox
And why is it that you like Eminem's rap ONLY? Find three good reasons for that, then I'll commend you-as well as prove something more in the process...standby.

Three good reasons for my liking a certain rapper? I don't need "good" reason, I like his rap so I'll listen to it. But seeing as how you're probably going for the "it's because you're racist" thing, I'll give you some reasons why.

First thing first, Eminem doesn't just rap about money, girls, and cars like 99% of all the other rappers do. Another thing, I can hardly understand a word that most rapper's say, while I can understand pretty much everything Eminem says. Oh yeah, and Eminem is just entertaining, he can make any words rhyme and make sense, and he's hilarious. "Will Smith doesn't have to cuss to sell his record, well I do. So **** him, and **** you too." He makes fun of everyone and I like that.

Gimme three good reasons why I should like Nelly, Snoop Dog, or other rappers and not Eminem.

[DeathsHand]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo

First thing first, Eminem doesn't just rap about money, girls, and cars like 99% of all the other rappers do. Another thing, I can hardly understand a word that most rapper's say, while I can understand pretty much everything Eminem says. Oh yeah, and Eminem is just entertaining, he can make any words rhyme and make sense, and he's hilarious. "Will Smith doesn't have to cuss to sell his record, well I do. So **** him, and **** you too." He makes fun of everyone and I like that.

I can't stand most rap, but I like Eminem's... Well, some of Eminem's... the stuff I've heard... For exactly the reasons Chris listed here :p Well, the first two at least... I can't stand how so many rappers sing about girls and cars and BLING BLING! And they don't even farkin' speak english half the time... :D

But Chris is still a racist bastard and should die...

J/K :burger:

[The Germanator]

I think I know what the problem is with some of these kids that only like Eminem. See, there ARE other artists out there in the hip-hop scene that IMO are much better than the mainstream stuff you hear today. I used to be like you and dislike hip-hop for some of the reasons you mentioned above and I thought I'd never like it, but now I am here, hip-hop pretty much my favorite genre. If you take the time and go to some Indie record stores, look for Deltron 3030, Kool Keith, Mos Def, Talib Kweli, El-P, Aesop Rock, Cannibal Ox, Paul Barman, Jurassic 5, Common, The Roots...etc, I could go on, but don't write off hip-hop as crap just because you hear a crappy Nelly or Jay-Z song on the radio because even I will agree with you that that stuff is crap. But research some underground hip-hop and at least give it a shot and is you still hate it, well i can't do anything about that. And I think because of some of the reasons you like Eminen, originality, creativity what have you, you'll like some of this stuff. I mean, Paul Barman is probably the funniest and smartest rapper I've ever heard, better than Eminem. Anyway, end of that little rant.

[bobcat]

That rev d00d looked like P Diddy hahah!

Yeh go Coolio. I wish that fat guy would shut up and let Coolio speak!

And Coolio did have a good point. Without power, you won't be able to make a significant influence on such a major thing (banning white's from rapping etc).

That rev will be known for being a racist, but that's about it. But Rev had some points too. Unfortunately they were outweighed by his ridiculous intentions

[yes_yes i am]

i hate when ppl try to be smart about something they dont know squat about. but anyways[QUOTE]Originally posted by Shadow Fox
[B]*walks into GT*

*enters thread*

*unsheathes memory*

*unsheathes...[what's that again? Oh yeah]- katana*

*waves to Saffire and Killaine*And why is it that you like Eminem's rap ONLY? Find three good reasons for that, then I'll commend you-as well as prove something more in the process...standby.


1. his enunciation - its the one of the best , if not the best out of all the rappers out there. (u can understand him)
2. his creativity and ability to tell a story.
3. his dre produced beats
4. his lyrics are one of the best in the game.

yes, some ppl have the same level of lyrical potential but that isnt enough. all those things and more are reasons why ppl like eminem.

Saffire brought this subject to my attention, and in fact, there are some interesting points brought up by all three parties (journalist, Coolio, and Scott) regarding the issue.

For one, Rev. Paul Scott is correct in the way that the first ammendment is "bended" to cater to the Americans of caucasian descent- think of how long rap was banned in many states because its GENERAL (not wholistic image), promoted violence, drugs and sex...while, well- do I even need to mention Ozzy Osborne, Aerosmith or Marylin Manson's lyrics?

There was even one point where the Million Man March was going to be stopped for fear of "deviant activity", when in actuality, any Woodstock or Spring Break concert could be ten times worse with tons of wild kids with no shirts and an assload of beer and whatnot. There is a difference.
what does this have to do with white ppl not being allowed to listen or write rap music? do u know what your saying? rap = rhythmic articulate poetry. so basically he is saying if some white person were to write a poem and then read it to a rhythm ... that wouldnt be allowed? u cant ban someone from writing poetry and reading it.


The other point is that rap was created and intended to be used for black people to express themselves fully across rhythmic beats and snares about life's trials and tribulation-thus the term "hip-hop culture". Money and mainstream media has, if not destroyed, totally crippled the stance and reason hip-hop stands as an artform- so why not add whatever you want to it now?

ok, what. u read a book that said rap was made by some guy and he said "this is for black people" yeah? and im pretty sure u didnt. how do u know that it wasnt a white person that first rapped? and im pretty sure the first time someone made a verse, or freestyled he didnt have a snare and a rhythm on him. maybe some guy wrote a poem and started saying it to a song.

i dont know. this is like saying who created singing? who created
drinking tea?


Those were about the only valid points Scott made in regards to this; seeing that he knows little to nothing about the entertainment industry (let alone the rap/hip-hop industry) as a whole.

The reporter (I forget his name), made up another interesting point- Eminem taunts the very reason why Scott should want rap banned from whites. Eminem speaks of how he's "the worst thing since Elvis Presley" (for the uneducated, "Rock and Roll" was taken from Jazz/Blues artforms, also founded by black slaves of the old south as motivational tools). He even speaks of how he "uses rap music rather selfishly" and "used it to get himself wealthy".

While I myself am a fan of Eminem as an artist (the fact that he bars the very buyers of his music through metaphors and blinds the average mind with a catch-phrase to conceal the message is very clever indeed-nwoChris happens to be one of those buyers ;) ), I do feel that Eminem needs to hold his toungue a tad (especially if there would be worldwide panic if say, Nelly started speaking in his same method), and that he does get a little too much favortism and is bending the genre. Since when does a rapper get on the cover of Rolling Stone Magazine? Hmmm...:rolleyes: And last I checked, there isn't a bit of "rock" on any album he's done (underground or mainstream), yet groups like Outkast and Goodie Mob have tons of rock samples or full songs, and get overlooked- maybe it's because they convey a strong, positive message, and not just "let the bodies hit the floor" over and over again, but eh...:rolleyes:

When was the last time you checked? maybe if u checked ever, ud know he did a song with kid rock. called f--- off and he had aerosmith on the chorus of a song on his new album. if aerosmith isnt rock then wtf is rock. he even had to redo a song on his album because it sounded too much like some -insert name here- song (maybe it was jimi hendrix i donno) (btw it was "haileys song")but thats not the point.
im not gonna discuss if eminem has any rock in him even tho he said 'my new album was heavily influenced by 70s rock music'. i dont think eminem needs to hold his tongue at all. just because of how many people know of him and his music. but w/e.

lol and dont gimmie that "subliminal message crap. ud have to be pretty slow to not realize those messages. maybe if ur 12.....


Finally, Coolio is DEFINATELY correct about the role of white America and rap music- it would not exist without the constant support (and finance tracking/publishing deals) given through the money wad that wealthy blacks (at that point in time) were too "afraid" to invest with. As far as white artists "taking away" from the industry, I doubt that will happen anytime soon. Even if it did, it's sure to make things interesting...Hell, look at football, baseball, basketball, and even golf and tennis now....alot more competitive than it once was in the "Jim Crow" assisted South and Northern United States in the days of old.



yea... if u take rap from whites. then take golf and baseball from blacks. and take basketball from whites. and then everything sucks.

While I do agree that the first ammendment does warrant freedom of speech across all race/genders, that has not ALWAYS been the case, even as of recent. I honestly do believe if the power of Congress was primarily in the hands of a race other than caucasian ethnicity, alot more freedom in music as a whole would be assessed across the entire racial spectrum.

yea probably. although 4 some reason eminem is getting flack for things other black ppl have said a million times b4.


But then again, that's just IMO, so sue me.;)

-......????


whats your telephone number , adress, and full name.


o and i don only like eminem if that wut ur thinking.

[yes_yes i am]

Originally posted by The Germanator
I think I know what the problem is with some of these kids that only like Eminem. See, there ARE other artists out there in the hip-hop scene that IMO are much better than the mainstream stuff you hear today. I used to be like you and dislike hip-hop for some of the reasons you mentioned above and I thought I'd never like it, but now I am here, hip-hop pretty much my favorite genre. If you take the time and go to some Indie record stores, look for Deltron 3030, Kool Keith, Mos Def, Talib Kweli, El-P, Aesop Rock, Cannibal Ox, Paul Barman, Jurassic 5, Common, The Roots...etc, I could go on, but don't write off hip-hop as crap just because you hear a crappy Nelly or Jay-Z song on the radio because even I will agree with you that that stuff is crap. But research some underground hip-hop and at least give it a shot and is you still hate it, well i can't do anything about that. And I think because of some of the reasons you like Eminen, originality, creativity what have you, you'll like some of this stuff. I mean, Paul Barman is probably the funniest and smartest rapper I've ever heard, better than Eminem. Anyway, end of that little rant.


^wut he said. but u dont need to go to a indie store for mos def. :p

[The Germanator]

Originally posted by yes_yes i am



^wut he said. but u dont need to go to a indie store for mos def. :p

Yeah, maybe not, but...he's still good. Don't contradict me! :D

[Mushlafa]

Originally posted by yes_yes i am
i hate when ppl try to be smart about something they dont know squat about. but anyways[QUOTE]Originally posted by Shadow Fox
[B]*walks into GT*

*enters thread*

*unsheathes memory*

*unsheathes...[what's that again? Oh yeah]- katana*

*waves to Saffire and Killaine*And why is it that you like Eminem's rap ONLY? Find three good reasons for that, then I'll commend you-as well as prove something more in the process...standby.


1. his enunciation - its the one of the best , if not the best out of all the rappers out there. (u can understand him)
2. his creativity and ability to tell a story.
3. his dre produced beats
4. his lyrics are one of the best in the game.

yes, some ppl have the same level of lyrical potential but that isnt enough. all those things and more are reasons why ppl like eminem.

Saffire brought this subject to my attention, and in fact, there are some interesting points brought up by all three parties (journalist, Coolio, and Scott) regarding the issue.

For one, Rev. Paul Scott is correct in the way that the first ammendment is "bended" to cater to the Americans of caucasian descent- think of how long rap was banned in many states because its GENERAL (not wholistic image), promoted violence, drugs and sex...while, well- do I even need to mention Ozzy Osborne, Aerosmith or Marylin Manson's lyrics?

There was even one point where the Million Man March was going to be stopped for fear of "deviant activity", when in actuality, any Woodstock or Spring Break concert could be ten times worse with tons of wild kids with no shirts and an assload of beer and whatnot. There is a difference.
what does this have to do with white ppl not being allowed to listen or write rap music? do u know what your saying? rap = rhythmic articulate poetry. so basically he is saying if some white person were to write a poem and then read it to a rhythm ... that wouldnt be allowed? u cant ban someone from writing poetry and reading it.


The other point is that rap was created and intended to be used for black people to express themselves fully across rhythmic beats and snares about life's trials and tribulation-thus the term "hip-hop culture". Money and mainstream media has, if not destroyed, totally crippled the stance and reason hip-hop stands as an artform- so why not add whatever you want to it now?

ok, what. u read a book that said rap was made by some guy and he said "this is for black people" yeah? and im pretty sure u didnt. how do u know that it wasnt a white person that first rapped? and im pretty sure the first time someone made a verse, or freestyled he didnt have a snare and a rhythm on him. maybe some guy wrote a poem and started saying it to a song.

i dont know. this is like saying who created singing? who created
drinking tea?


Those were about the only valid points Scott made in regards to this; seeing that he knows little to nothing about the entertainment industry (let alone the rap/hip-hop industry) as a whole.

The reporter (I forget his name), made up another interesting point- Eminem taunts the very reason why Scott should want rap banned from whites. Eminem speaks of how he's "the worst thing since Elvis Presley" (for the uneducated, "Rock and Roll" was taken from Jazz/Blues artforms, also founded by black slaves of the old south as motivational tools). He even speaks of how he "uses rap music rather selfishly" and "used it to get himself wealthy".

While I myself am a fan of Eminem as an artist (the fact that he bars the very buyers of his music through metaphors and blinds the average mind with a catch-phrase to conceal the message is very clever indeed-nwoChris happens to be one of those buyers ;) ), I do feel that Eminem needs to hold his toungue a tad (especially if there would be worldwide panic if say, Nelly started speaking in his same method), and that he does get a little too much favortism and is bending the genre. Since when does a rapper get on the cover of Rolling Stone Magazine? Hmmm...:rolleyes: And last I checked, there isn't a bit of "rock" on any album he's done (underground or mainstream), yet groups like Outkast and Goodie Mob have tons of rock samples or full songs, and get overlooked- maybe it's because they convey a strong, positive message, and not just "let the bodies hit the floor" over and over again, but eh...:rolleyes:

When was the last time you checked? maybe if u checked ever, ud know he did a song with kid rock. called f--- off and he had aerosmith on the chorus of a song on his new album. if aerosmith isnt rock then wtf is rock. he even had to redo a song on his album because it sounded too much like some -insert name here- song (maybe it was jimi hendrix i donno) (btw it was "haileys song")but thats not the point.
im not gonna discuss if eminem has any rock in him even tho he said 'my new album was heavily influenced by 70s rock music'. i dont think eminem needs to hold his tongue at all. just because of how many people know of him and his music. but w/e.

lol and dont gimmie that "subliminal message crap. ud have to be pretty slow to not realize those messages. maybe if ur 12.....


Finally, Coolio is DEFINATELY correct about the role of white America and rap music- it would not exist without the constant support (and finance tracking/publishing deals) given through the money wad that wealthy blacks (at that point in time) were too "afraid" to invest with. As far as white artists "taking away" from the industry, I doubt that will happen anytime soon. Even if it did, it's sure to make things interesting...Hell, look at football, baseball, basketball, and even golf and tennis now....alot more competitive than it once was in the "Jim Crow" assisted South and Northern United States in the days of old.



yea... if u take rap from whites. then take golf and baseball from blacks. and take basketball from whites. and then everything sucks.

While I do agree that the first ammendment does warrant freedom of speech across all race/genders, that has not ALWAYS been the case, even as of recent. I honestly do believe if the power of Congress was primarily in the hands of a race other than caucasian ethnicity, alot more freedom in music as a whole would be assessed across the entire racial spectrum.

yea probably. although 4 some reason eminem is getting flack for things other black ppl have said a million times b4.


But then again, that's just IMO, so sue me.;)

-......????


whats your telephone number , adress, and full name.


o and i don only like eminem if that wut ur thinking.

bravo... give him some dblns.. :p

yeah.. umm.. i agree?

[Shadow Fox]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo


Three good reasons for my liking a certain rapper? I don't need "good" reason, I like his rap so I'll listen to it. But seeing as how you're probably going for the "it's because you're racist" thing, I'll give you some reasons why.

First thing first, Eminem doesn't just rap about money, girls, and cars like 99% of all the other rappers do. Another thing, I can hardly understand a word that most rapper's say, while I can understand pretty much everything Eminem says. Oh yeah, and Eminem is just entertaining, he can make any words rhyme and make sense, and he's hilarious. "Will Smith doesn't have to cuss to sell his record, well I do. So **** him, and **** you too." He makes fun of everyone and I like that.

Gimme three good reasons why I should like Nelly, Snoop Dog, or other rappers and not Eminem. I'm mad you mentioned "Nelly"...

*bashes head into wall*

Anyway, EVERY reason you mentioned about Eminem can be said about ALOT of respectable rappers in the industry (i.e. OutKast, Goodie Mob, Pharoh Monche, Joe Buttons, Witchdoctor, Ludacris, Deccade, Jatis, ICP, T-Rock, Pastor Troy, Nas, etc.)...

If I were to pit one artist against your opinion, it would more-or-less be Andre 3000 from Outkast. Like Eminem, the man can more than make words rhyme and make sense- an entire song was written against corporate America and it's flaws in a seemingly simple song- until you actually read between the lines and truly listen to the lyrics. The song "The Whole World" ring a bell? Even in the video the Outkast crew dresses up like "mooboo" acts (white men who painted their faces black in the early twenties as a political gag) and entertain a corporate audience in cynical respect.

That's alot deeper than any Eminem song I've ever heard, though I believe "I am" (the song, NOT the video/single) came pretty close to Eminem's full potential as a thought-provoking artist.

And further more, the last time Outkast even collectively did a song about girls and glamor was the 1994 hit, "Players Ball".

And no, 99% of rappers don't rap about money, cars, and women- if anything, it's about drugs, hard life, and lack of money- but then again, you're probably talking about mainstream rap (what you may eventually catch on MTV/BET countdowns, and "mixed" radio stations), in which case it's 100% of rappers talking about money, cars, and women.:mad:

But anyways, it's all based on what you see, and if you don't see alot of hardcore, real, or political/self-conscious rap lyrics abound in the industry, that's no one's fault but your own. My collection is full of deep (probably too deep for the average school kid), conscious lyrics, and I love them more and more for the Animal Farm-esque satirical pounces they constantly achieve.

-.....???

[nWoCHRISnWo]

I'm not a huge fan of any kind of music, and I don't go out of my way to listen to certain rappers. I can easily find an Eminem CD or hear his songs on the radio/TV so I've grown to like his stuff. If I have to go way out of my way to listen to certain people, it's not worth it for me. Everyone seems to think mainstream music is all crap... If it was all crap, then millions of people wouldn't like it like they do. If these indy guys or whatever guys you (this goes for anyone who mentioned any "less popular" rap/hip hop people) were talking about aren't on the radio or TV, chances are people don't like them as much as people like Eminem.

[Shadow Fox]

Originally posted by yes_yes i am
i hate when ppl try to be smart about something they dont know squat about. but anywaysWHOA- stop RIGHT THERE. Before you even THINK of contemplating my knowledge of the music industry (since I myself am an artist), I'd suggest you'd visit the Bluff, Bowen Homes or Thomasville before you go any further on attempting to educate me on deep lyrics, or the lack thereof.
1. his enunciation - its the one of the best , if not the best out of all the rappers out there. (u can understand him)
2. his creativity and ability to tell a story.
3. his dre produced beats
4. his lyrics are one of the best in the game.1. Depends on what you are used to. In comparsion, Andre 3000, Nas, T-Rock the Rocafella, C-Lo-Goodie, and Pastor Troy (just a sample) have better enunciation in most syllabic chunks and emphasize the stronger choice words (AKA add-lib).
2. Once again I point to: Outkast, Goodie Mob, Jay-Z, Lil' Kim, Notorious B.I.G., T-Rock, Jatis, Deccade, and LL Cool-J.
3. This has no concern, as in this respect, every 2Pac, Snoop Dogg, Nate Dogg, Daz Dillenger, and new NWA midi composition was written by Dr. Dre. I've heard better from DJ Sheats, Neptunes, Timbaland, and Swiss Beats on several occasions.
4. Agreed, but Eminem is NOT THE best- hell, even Busta Rhymes more commercial lyrics of recent are alot better in delivery and content than alot of Eminem's rants- although Eminem's are much more entertaining (containing humor).yes, some ppl have the same level of lyrical potential but that isnt enough. all those things and more are reasons why ppl like eminem.And as I have pointed out in the list above, there are even more reasons why "ppl" like other artists.what does this have to do with white ppl not being allowed to listen or write rap music? do u know what your saying?Did you listen to what I was saying? These were points brought out by the people conducting the interview; but I'm assuming you'd know that had you actually watched the entire presentation given in the link. rap = rhythmic articulate poetry. so basically he is saying if some white person were to write a poem and then read it to a rhythm ... that wouldnt be allowed? u cant ban someone from writing poetry and reading it.As I was saying, that's what HE (Rev. Scott) said, not myself. Quit getting it twisted- I only agreed with the point he made about some political stances, not the main issue at hand.
ok, what. u read a book that said rap was made by some guy and he said "this is for black people" yeah? and im pretty sure u didnt. how do u know that it wasnt a white person that first rapped? and im pretty sure the first time someone made a verse, or freestyled he didnt have a snare and a rhythm on him. maybe some guy wrote a poem and started saying it to a song.Or maybe you are trying to discredit me by making a guess in comparision to an actual Black History documentary I have on the "essence of rap/hip-hop culture" (ever watch BET?). How amusing.

i dont know. Exactly. And further more...When was the last time you checked? maybe if u checked ever, ud know he did a song with kid rock. called f--- off and he had aerosmith on the chorus of a song on his new album. Hmm...let's see- the last time I checked was in 2000, which was when Eminem first appeared in Rolling Stone. Let's see...no Kid Rock or Aerosmith at that point in time, which was the point. A song was eventually going to be made in this genre (with Fred Durst), but internal conflicts destroyed chances of that happening. And as far as Eminem holding his tongue back, what would truly prove Eminem as an artist would be an entire album w/o contriversial and violent topics- because right now, he isn't showing enough talent to pull that off (hell, 50-cent did 8 albums with the same content as Eminem, and it wouldn't even get radio play-besides "I'm gonna rob the industry".)...I myself believe Eminem CAN do it (to a certain extent), but like everthing else in the world, he has to prove it.lol and dont gimmie that "subliminal message crap. ud have to be pretty slow to not realize those messages. maybe if ur 12....I definately agree- which is why Eminem can't compete in lyrical content to the likes of Common, Outkast, Biggie, T-Rock, Goodie Mob, Jay-Z (reasonable doubt era), Joe Buttons, etc. Ultra-deep content is the true karma of the artform, as how that's how it was originally intended to be- not a showcase for high school children.yea... if u take rap from whites. then take golf and baseball from blacks. and take basketball from whites. and then everything sucks.Um, ok....yea probably. although 4 some reason eminem is getting flack for things other black ppl have said a million times b4.You mean the same things that for some reason, do not warrant them an appearance on the cover of rolling stone? Or do you mean the same harsh topics that almost got rap banned in 1987 (anyone recall Too Short?)???:rolleyes:whats your telephone number , adress, and full name.No prank calls, but here's the full addy:

13 Bankhead Courts Apts
135 Bankhead Hwy
Atlanta, GA 30314

(p.s. make sure you stop by the Bluff before you get there ;) )

Have fun on your trip down to GA, folk.;)

o and i don only like eminem if that wut ur thinking.no, what I'm thinking is you have no clue as to what the music industry as a whole entails, let alone deep lyric writing and critique.

*sheathes katana*

*vanishes into the day*

-.....???

[Shadow Fox]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo
I'm not a huge fan of any kind of music, and I don't go out of my way to listen to certain rappers. I can easily find an Eminem CD or hear his songs on the radio/TV so I've grown to like his stuff. If I have to go way out of my way to listen to certain people, it's not worth it for me. Everyone seems to think mainstream music is all crap... If it was all crap, then millions of people wouldn't like it like they do. If these indy guys or whatever guys you (this goes for anyone who mentioned any "less popular" rap/hip hop people) were talking about aren't on the radio or TV, chances are people don't like them as much as people like Eminem. Hmm...last I checked, Outkast's last album (Stankonia) went multiplatinum in 8 days...but eh...;)

And if you are referring to me remotely, not one artist I mentioned lacks a radio or television appearance with their music.

-....???

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Here's a list of people you gave me earlier: OutKast, Goodie Mob, Pharoh Monche, Joe Buttons, Witchdoctor, Ludacris, Deccade, Jatis, ICP, T-Rock, Pastor Troy, and Nas.

I don't know any songs by nine of these artists. If I watched my regular TV viewing for let's say three days, I'd heard an Eminem song at least three times. Other than that, I might see OutKast or Ludacris, and I haven't liked anything I've heard from them yet.

And you keep saying things like this : "Eminem is NOT THE best" (that was in regard to lyrics). That is what we call an OPINION. People have different opinions, I hope you know that. I'm not sure exactly why you're trying to prove that Eminem isn't my favourite rapper, because that's impossible to do. If the people you keep naming as being better than Eminem are shown on TV and heard on the radio, then surely I've heard them before (although maybe not knowing who they are) and I haven't liked any rap I've ever heard other than Eminem's...

[Drunk Hobbit]

Stopped listening to rap shortly after Biggy Smalls died. Btw, whatever happened to Ma$e?

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/bo/2002/bo020816.gif

[bobcat]

Originally posted by Danchastu
Stopped listening to rap shortly after Biggy Smalls died. Btw, whatever happened to Ma$e?

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/bo/2002/bo020816.gif

:lol:

I h8 Ja Rule. Especially that song where that little midget sings "I do, you do, we do, let's do, do do". :mad2:

It really irritates me. I think Eminem should rap a song about Ja Rule and his little friends (especially that little do do friend)

[gekko]

Originally posted by Danchastu
Btw, whatever happened to Ma$e?

He put out a 2nd album, it flopped, he took his money and ran.

[Shadow Fox]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo
Here's a list of people you gave me earlier: OutKast, Goodie Mob, Pharoh Monche, Joe Buttons, Witchdoctor, Ludacris, Deccade, Jatis, ICP, T-Rock, Pastor Troy, and Nas.

I don't know any songs by nine of these artists. If I watched my regular TV viewing for let's say three days, I'd heard an Eminem song at least three times. Other than that, I might see OutKast or Ludacris, and I haven't liked anything I've heard from them yet.That's an interesting point; and one I knew you'd point out sooner or later. That's exactly what "mainstream" is- songs "played out" day in and day out (who here isn't sick of "cleaning out my closet" by now?). And naturally, what you hear more, you are more accustomed to- no argument there; exactly what I see everyday with other mainstream folks.And you keep saying things like this : "Eminem is NOT THE best" (that was in regard to lyrics). That is what we call an OPINION. People have different opinions, I hope you know that. I'm not sure exactly why you're trying to prove that Eminem isn't my favourite rapper, because that's impossible to do. If the people you keep naming as being better than Eminem are shown on TV and heard on the radio, then surely I've heard them before (although maybe not knowing who they are) and I haven't liked any rap I've ever heard other than Eminem's... No one isn't forcing any opinion on anyone, and if you read my post, it clearly stated "this is IMO, so sue me." I'm guessing you missed that part...:rolleyes:

Anyhow, my point with you wasn't to prove you don't like Eminem, it was to show that your reasons for liking him are no different than that of quite a few other rappers in the industry, so that if it was up to you, you COULD actually like more than just Eminem as a lyricist-guess I gotta point that out too...

Eh, but your opinion is your opinion- I proved what I needed to, and your responses were predicted. The sad part is alot of peeps think the same way you do, and alot of promising artists get passed over by the more mainstream images.

-...???

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Yeah, I COULD also like more kinds of food if I tried every food there was, and I COULD like more games if I tried every game out there, etc. But as of now, the only rap that I like (that I heard, as I can't like something if I haven't heard it before) is from Eminem, which was my original statement, and nothing has changed. Therefore, this little debate was a waste of time wouldn't you say?

[The Germanator]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo
I'm not a huge fan of any kind of music, and I don't go out of my way to listen to certain rappers. I can easily find an Eminem CD or hear his songs on the radio/TV so I've grown to like his stuff. If I have to go way out of my way to listen to certain people, it's not worth it for me. Everyone seems to think mainstream music is all crap... If it was all crap, then millions of people wouldn't like it like they do. If these indy guys or whatever guys you (this goes for anyone who mentioned any "less popular" rap/hip hop people) were talking about aren't on the radio or TV, chances are people don't like them as much as people like Eminem.

O.k, well yes, of course chances are that people don't like them as much as Eminem...ya know why? Because people obviously haven't even heard of these people being how ****ed-up the music industry is. And you mention that you aren't going to out of the way to hear new music? Than I guess you will never hear anything better than Eminem in your opinion if you don't try. Deltron 3030 (AKA Del Tha Funky Homosapien) single-handedly got me back into hip-hop, it only took me a couple listens of his record to get me into the underground/ indie hip-hop scene. Same goes with Mos Def...Than, once I heard them, I start ed listening to other rappers on the same labels, then I read reviews on new "up and comers" on the scene and the process continues. Basically, it was 2 artists that got me into it, and now that I know so much more about it I haven't stopped. Maybe it's just me, but listen to Deltron 3030 and Mos Def's "Black on Both Sides" (both probably can be found fairly easily, they both have had mild commercial sucess) and maybe, just maybe it will get you intrigued or interested. Also read http://www.pitchforkmedia.com and check out the new reviews everyday because that has kept me updated day to day on not only the newest indie-rap, but indie-rock and other interesting original music. The indie-scene in general is difficult to get into because frankly it's a minority industry at this point. I mean, I know I would have never gotten into it all if my friends hadn't showed me some of that good stuff and now that I read about and purchase this music on my own, I'm at an all-time high in my music listening days. See, the problem is that people don't know what they are missing...Mainstream music is just so much in all of our faces that it's really tough to see anything else. This reason itself is why this other music IMO is better, because they aren't trying to impress anyone, they are doing what they want basically and as a result the music is usually of a higher quality. And about it being difficult to find...go to CDnow.com, they have any CD you could pretty much ever want or even half.com because it is cheaper. And if anyone is interested in some quality indie music, PM or IM me or something. Not that I'm an expert or anything, but I could at least give you some good direction as to where to start with indie-rock, indie-pop, or indie-hip hop. Allright...that was stupid sorry, but I don't feel like deleting it, so deal with it! :p

[Xantar]

So white folks get rap, heavy metal and the majority of pop music. Black folks get rap and R&B. Once again, the Asian folks get left out. :mad:

*goes back to driving his jacked up car to private school*

Kidding, just kidding. But let's get down to some substance now.

Germanator, I see you mentioned The Roots in your list. I'm not a hunter of indie records by any stretch, but I imagine you've heard Rahzel singing "If Your Mother Only Knew." Man, when I heard that I knew I would have to go out and get a Roots CD. Sure, The Roots don't use double-voicing as their entire act, but it still got me hooked.

Everyone seems to think mainstream music is all crap... If it was all crap, then millions of people wouldn't like it like they do. If these indy guys or whatever guys you (this goes for anyone who mentioned any "less popular" rap/hip hop people) were talking about aren't on the radio or TV, chances are people don't like them as much as people like Eminem.

You seem to believe that public opinion shapes programming on TV and radio stations. You would be quite wrong. The truth is more the other way around (although the public still has some say). It's a known fact that most people will just settle for mediocrity instead of the best. The majority of people will settle for something that might be downright awful compared to the best out there. This doesn't just apply to pop culture (where the judgment of "best" is too nebulous to really analyze closely) but also to just about any other market. Rather than people liking Eminem just because they do, the reason they like him is probably something more like this.

I can easily find an Eminem CD or hear his songs on the radio/TV so I've grown to like his stuff. If I have to go way out of my way to listen to certain people, it's not worth it for me.

This is not to say that Eminem is bad. I personally wouldn't know since I don't listen to his music, but he certainly seems much better at rapping than I could ever hope to be. I'm just pointing out that your contention that certain artists don't get exposure because most people don't like them is flawed.

[Shadow Fox]

Originally posted by nWoCHRISnWo
Yeah, I COULD also like more kinds of food if I tried every food there was, and I COULD like more games if I tried every game out there, etc. But as of now, the only rap that I like (that I heard, as I can't like something if I haven't heard it before) is from Eminem, which was my original statement, and nothing has changed. Therefore, this little debate was a waste of time wouldn't you say? Nope, I proved my point with you, and you are basically agreeing with me in this post. I also made solid observations of certain issues I agree with said by all three parties of this political interview, and spoke my opinion on why.

So in fact, it wasn't pointless at all, I got to speak for once on something serious at GT (very, VERY rare occasion), and you got to learn that ALOT of rap industry artists have the very same qualities you like Eminem ONLY for.

Definately not a waste of time to me.;)Originally posted by Xantar
So white folks get rap, heavy metal and the majority of pop music. Black folks get rap and R&B. Once again, the Asian folks get left out.

*goes back to driving his jacked up car to private school*

Kidding, just kidding. But let's get down to some substance now.

Germanator, I see you mentioned The Roots in your list. I'm not a hunter of indie records by any stretch, but I imagine you've heard Rahzel singing "If Your Mother Only Knew." Man, when I heard that I knew I would have to go out and get a Roots CD. Sure, The Roots don't use double-voicing as their entire act, but it still got me hooked.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Everyone seems to think mainstream music is all crap... If it was all crap, then millions of people wouldn't like it like they do. If these indy guys or whatever guys you (this goes for anyone who mentioned any "less popular" rap/hip hop people) were talking about aren't on the radio or TV, chances are people don't like them as much as people like Eminem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



You seem to believe that public opinion shapes programming on TV and radio stations. You would be quite wrong. The truth is more the other way around (although the public still has some say). It's a known fact that most people will just settle for mediocrity instead of the best. The majority of people will settle for something that might be downright awful compared to the best out there. This doesn't just apply to pop culture (where the judgment of "best" is too nebulous to really analyze closely) but also to just about any other market. Rather than people liking Eminem just because they do, the reason they like him is probably something more like this.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I can easily find an Eminem CD or hear his songs on the radio/TV so I've grown to like his stuff. If I have to go way out of my way to listen to certain people, it's not worth it for me.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



This is not to say that Eminem is bad. I personally wouldn't know since I don't listen to his music, but he certainly seems much better at rapping than I could ever hope to be. I'm just pointing out that your contention that certain artists don't get exposure because most people don't like them is flawed.I couldn't agree more.

*high-fives Xantar*

*leaps into tree with Mya*

-...??

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Xantar, you implied that the reason so many people like Eminem is probably because "you can easily find his CD or music on TV"and whatnot, right? I do agree, but why do you think his CD's are everywhere and his music videos are always on TV? If he wasn't popular as he is, then he'd never get the chance to get so much time on TV. if people didn't like him in the first place, there wouldn't be a big demand for his stuff, thus it wouldn't be played nearly as much. It's just a big cycle, people like his stuff, and it's played a lot.

[Xantar]

Yes, it is a big cycle, but you also have to consider that Eminem and his record aren't the only force working in the industry. Eminem fans listen to other music, too. The vast majority of people listen to mainstream music, and so probably do Eminem fans. So the reason so many people like Eminem is in part because he is more mainstream than a lot of rappers. His music is more similar to the other stuff they listen to than the music of some other rappers. This isn't to say that he uses the same theme or the same kind of lyrics or anything like that. It could be something as simple as the fact that he sometimes uses catchy background music. But I won't go into a deep analysis here.

There is such a thing as an artist who produces something absolutely brilliant and creates a fanbase around himself purely on the strength of his talent. But such an artist is someone who redefines or completely invents a genre, puts it on the cultural map. I'm talking about something like The Beatles coming onto the scene and ever afterwards every rock and roll band using a strong drum beat and a set of guitars and singing songs with a repeating chorus. So it is with rap. Somebody at a point in time created the form and popularized it (I don't know who, but the genre had to be born somewhere). Afterwards, other rap artists come on the scene. They may be talented, but in the end they are riding on the coattails of this first person. I do not believe that Eminem is such a genre defining artist. He is one of the people who follow. This isn't a bad thing at all, but it gives you an insight into how he got his publishing deals with his record company. He did some songs and somebody realized that his songs would sell because they were in some way like the other stuff that sells. So the record company takes some risks in promoting Eminem, but they know that his songs will sell and moreover they know that marketing is going to have a big effect. How did Scooby Doo make money? The initial approval of the project was something of a gamble, but movie studios also know that having lots of TV commercials, trailers and billboards everywhere is also going to bring in quite a lot of people. They create their own demand. I certainly don't think they benefited from people thinking, "Hmm...a live action version of Scooby Doo. Sounds like a gread idea!"