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Old 01-26-2003, 07:14 PM   #16
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Have you not seen Ratchet and Clank?
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Old 01-26-2003, 11:46 PM   #17
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I think Ratchet and Clank looks better than Super Mario Sunshine, if we had to compare similar games...

but I don't want to turn this into a PS2 vs. GC vs. Xbox graphics contest...we all know PS2 comes in third, and obviously doesn't impress anyone these days (if ever).

the question was whether or not the aging of the PS2 hardware is having an affect on games, consumers and sales.

Graphics whores will always go for XBox, high end PC or maybe even Gamecube. Gekko mentioned one of the reasons why he can't play SOCOM anymore were the GOD AWFUL visuals with BLURRY TEXTURES AND JAGGIES. To him, that's a valid complaint. To me it would be splitting hairs. It's not like the game was unplayable.
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Old 01-27-2003, 11:56 AM   #18
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Ps2, much like Psx, doesn't need drop-dead graphics to compete.

I know this isn't the base of the topic, but it's the truth about the situation. While gekko says:

Quote:
With that said, PS2 still doesn't compare with Xbox or Gamecube. It just doesn't have the power to compete.
I can say with confidence that Xbox and GCN simply don't have the game quality to compete.

Console power is overrated among hardcore gamers and it has little to nothing to do with what makes a console "good". Take N64 for example, it didn't sell 50 million units because it's graphics were great, it was because it had the game quality and marketability to compete... period.

Do graphics make a difference? Yes... but nobody in thier right mind would chose Luigi's Mansion over Zelda OoT (even back then) for game of the year. Great games make a great system, graphics are just a bonus.

The funny part is, people look back at Dreamcast's competition against Ps2's launch and acctually say that Dreamcast games look better! What a joke, the fact is you simply liked DC's games more and that enhanced the look of the game in your mind.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, as for the topic, I agree with Stu, I don't like to compare screenshots. Why? Because in the early days of Ps2 the way the shots were captured were horrible. The only way to truly judge a game is by seeing it in action. Sometimes Screenshots make a game look a lot better (FFX) and sometimes screenshots make a game look a lot worse (Too many games to list).

IMO, Ps2 has shown maturity in it's sequals. Compare GTA3 to Vice City, or Madden 2002 to 2003... Smackdown 3 to SMackdown 4.. Huge positive differences.
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Old 01-27-2003, 12:40 PM   #19
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I think that the positive changes are the key contributer to the PS2 not becoming outdated any time soon. I think gekko mentioned something about that. Most games in the PS2's first 6-8 months were very poor graphically (with the OBVIOUS exception of Gran Turismo 3) but now some games (MGS2, BG: DA, R&C, ICO) hold their own, graphically, aganist competing systems' games.

I don't know whether or not the PS2's hardware weakness will affect the system in the long run. If every XBox game starts to look like Halo 2 and every Gamecube game Metroid Prime, then the difference could be staggering. I figure PS2's software has kept it on top so far, and that's probably what, if anything, will keep it there.
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Old 01-27-2003, 01:08 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Perfect Stu
I don't know whether or not the PS2's hardware weakness will affect the system in the long run. If every XBox game starts to look like Halo 2 and every Gamecube game Metroid Prime, then the difference could be staggering. I figure PS2's software has kept it on top so far, and that's probably what, if anything, will keep it there.
We will never have to worry about that, as long as Ps2 is ahead of the pack. If you think about it, how many big thier party games are there out for GCN/Xbox that aren't Ps2/Dreamcast ports?

as long as Ps2 gets the game first, the games will never reach thier full potiental on other consoles.

Now, if every 1st party games starts looking great, maybe that could make a difference. But I still feel that looks alone won't make Ps2 out-dated. Look at Psx for instance... Psx's graphics were way out-dated when compared to N64 but the games weren't.There could be 2-3 more GTA games this generation with equal or maybe a little better graphics than GTA:VC and just a better story and the game would still not be out-dated next to GCN and Xbox games that look 10x as good because the gameplay saves it.

Exclusives won't make a difference because most gamers simply don't compare the looks of exclusive games (unless they happen to own the more powerful less-popular console)... The way to prove to gamers that one system out-preforms another is by displaying a multi-playform game that completly shows the difference. Even then most people won't be sold on the idea.

In the N64 days I used to brag about how Madden on 64 killed off the Psx's game in looks did anybody else go out and get the new console for the new Madden? Nope. Because even under the blanket of better visualls it was still the same game. There would have to be a HUGE difference for people to sell on these better graphics, a Huge difference that Xbox and GCN can't offer.

Which brings me to what could make the Ps2 out-dated:

Animation

XBX and GCN have displayed more clarity in every way, but when there is no improvement in anamation what's the point? Madden 2003 to the untrained eye looks exactly the same accross all three platforms because they all animate the same. GCN and Xbox definently have better textures and more clear/crisp colors but that isn't enough... still the same game.

Now, if Ps2 had some Dreamcast graphics and Psx animation... then there's a problem. As long as Ps2 keeps up in animation, everything should stay just fine.

As for first party titles there is a huge difference because they are different games. Which games come closest to reality? Oh wait, that doesn't matter because some games aren't trying to achive reality, they are all trying for different things. So in order to have a comparision two games would have to directly compete.

What racer is so realistic that it destroys GT3? What free roaming action game destroys GTA3? None. So as long as the games all have thier different styles other consoles can't make Ps2 look out-dated.

Like I said, it would take a port (maybe of a great selling game) to knock the Ps2's socks off, and that ain't happening.

Ps2 will not be out-dated until Ps3 comes out. Developers haven't even come close to Ps2's limits yet, so don't expect the visuals on Ps2 to stop getting better any time soon. Also, until 1st party developers start mimicing games like GTA:VC and GT3 don't expect the games to be out-dated.
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Old 01-28-2003, 10:14 AM   #21
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People the hardware DOESN'T MATTER!! They are consoles of the same generation... although the PS2 is way behind.

The only thing that the PS2 needs is a reasonable price tag!! X-Box is more powerful and has an HD... The PS2 should cost half the price of the X-Box. Then the outdated hardware won't matter... but the same price it will turn off consumers.
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Old 01-28-2003, 10:31 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by tarakan69
The only thing that the PS2 needs is a reasonable price tag!! X-Box is more powerful and has an HD... The PS2 should cost half the price of the X-Box. Then the outdated hardware won't matter... but the same price it will turn off consumers.
It will turn off consumers? Sony currently owns 60% of the North American console market...it hasn't turned off consumers. When it does, I'm more than sure Sony will lower the system's price to $150 max.
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Old 01-28-2003, 11:04 AM   #23
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Yep, Sony has the whole industry by the throat... they keep the price at $200 because they still can. Sony also knows no matter how low they drop the price tag, Xbox will go down to equal, and GCN will drop lower.
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