[jeepnut]

Originally Posted by Teuthida

More like it seems most of those could be done either through slight of hand, or having someone else set it up for him. Too good to be true would be Jesus growing wings, summoning a flying whale and the two doing a synchronized dance in the sky while making it rain tiny dancing frogs dressed in the 1st century equivalent of tuxedos. Now that sounds godly to me.

Or riding in a sleigh pulled by flying reindeer visiting children around the world in a single night and leaving them presents. That sounds like a god.

How? Almost all of Jesus's miracles had numerous witnesses. How do you fake cutting off an ear and immediately repairing it? How do you fake giving sight to a blind man that the whole town knew had been born blind? How do you fake feeding 5,000 people with seven loaves and two fish? (Keep in mind they were many miles into the wilderness. An awfully long way to carry food for 5,000) How do you fake raising a man that many witnessed dying from a sealed tomb after having been dead for four days? As the saying goes, you can fool all of the people some of the time or all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time.

To me, you're grasping at straws here. Despite your assertions, few would claim that these are easy tricks for anyone to perform today, much less in Jesus' time with first century technology.

You're better off claiming that it never happened in the first place. I've already demonstrated significant evidence that these accounts are believable. What evidence have you demonstrated that the bible should not be believed?

Originally Posted by Teuthida

It's a raised platform slightly below the surface of the water. There's an episode of Mythbusters where they build one as well to bust a viral video of people running on the surface of a lake. It's just bits of wood nailed together. Surely something a carpenter could bang out in a jiffy.

That's a funny video. However, I again think you are grasping at straws. Look at the account in the bible and where it occurred. This happened on the Sea of Galilee. The sea averages 84 feet in depth. The account states that the disciples were 25 or 30 furlongs away from their starting point. 25 furlongs is 5 kilometers. Using a depth chart, this puts the location of the disciples at a minimum depth of 75 feet and potentially in the deepest part of the sea at 141 feet. Do you know of a carpenter that can bang out a platform in 75 foot deep water in a "jiffy"? If he did, I'd call that a miracle.

Furthermore, the account states that this happened in the midst of a storm in which the disciples were "distressed by the waves". Keep in mind that many of these men were fishermen and spent a lot of their lives on this sea. These must have been some significant waves. Do you know anyone who could walk on a platform just below the water in the midst of a storm?

Also, the platform theory does not account for Peter walking on the sea for a short period of time and then losing faith and sinking.

As I stated above, I think you're grasping at straws.

Originally Posted by Teuthida

As for the healing, unless there is documented proof (from a doctor and not from a book where snakes talk to people) that a person was sick and upon laying his hands on them or whatever he did, they got better, I will never believe that. I'm far more inclined to believe he was a skilled magician and/or surgeon, rather than a god. And the people seeing him do such things that they never saw before, believed them to be miracles. If he did them at all...or existed.

Our modern cures for leprosy take months to work. The lepers were cured instantly. Are you arguing that they were never sick in the first place?

Originally Posted by Teuthida

What did Jesus sacrifice exactly? The world didn't suddenly become a less shitty place when he died. People still "sin". A lot of people sin in his name.

Jesus, fully human, sacrificed his life through tremendous suffering (crucifixion is a brutal way to die, look it up) that we may have eternal life with God if we choose it. Choose is the active word there. We still have free will and therefore can still sin. We are even free to sin in Jesus' name if we wish to claim so. That is what free will means. Jesus did not die to take away our humanity and our ability to freely choose to sin.

God is not the cause of suffering.

Originally Posted by Teuthida

Can you explain to me why God/Jesus feels the need to be worshiped? It always seemed sort of silly that this supposedly supremely powerful being that created everything in existence, requires people to like him. I was raised Jewish (it didn't take) and the number one thing I remember is over and over again saying that you shouldn't have any other gods before him. Why does he care? I imagine him like a whiny teenage girl. "Guuuuuys, I'm the only real god. This Becky you're going on about doesn't even exist. And don't get me started of Britney. Such a cow. Pay attention to meeee."

God created us and God loves us. To love someone is to desire happiness for that person. (True happiness, not earthly happiness and certainly not our modern definition of happiness.) God did not have to create us or the universe. Because God chose to create us and because He loves us, He desires that His creation (created in His image and likeness) love Him and share in His joy.

Can you imagine creating life and not caring what happens to it?