*Confirmed* N5 Backwards Compatible

[Jonbo298]

In an interview with Famitsu, the head of Nintendo Satoru Iwata has stated the N5 will have backwards compatibility.

"It will be able to use the games already created in the previous generation. And it is something that will work. Side performances and graphics, one reached today a kind of limit with a quality which is already close to realism and it will be difficult to still much better do. The role of Nintendo is thus to study other ways in order to improve the experience of the player."

http://www.cube-europe.com/news.php?nid=5916

I like hearing this. So will this mean the controller will be somewhat similar to the GCN, except with a few tweaks that are needed.

[gekko]

I'll hold out for a real story. Coming from Cube-Europe it just throws up a red flag, then being from a Famitsu interview makes it even more reliable. Famitsu is reliable, but American sites saying they got news out of Famitsu can be completely BS. In fact, some of the largest rumors are caused by American sites posting BS that they say is from Famitsu, but it never was in the magazine. Here's an idea, stop hiring 13 year old kids who say they're Japanese to be your correspondents! :rolleyes:

[Jonbo298]

Well, heres another source.
http://www.gamecubeland.com/index.php?page=news&news_id=2009

If the IGNCube staff wasn't so damn lazy on the holiday's, they would be able to confirm if its 100% true or not. But since IGN is a big company, they feel they deserve 2 weeks off for no reason.

[gekko]

Why the hell would you work over Xmas? They're videogames, they only come out once a week, it's not like it's urgent information. You wouldn't catch me working Xmas if I worked at IGN either.

[Jonbo298]

Why the hell would you work over Xmas? They're videogames, they only come out once a week, it's not like it's urgent information. You wouldn't catch me working Xmas if I worked at IGN either.

gekko, do you have any rage you are trying to hide inside you?:p

[Ginkasa]

I've never heard of "Gamecube Land" or this "Gamecube Network" they say is their source. I don't think it really makes it any more reliable.

I agree with gekko. I'll wait until IGN or Gamespot reports it.


*shrugs and walks away*

[DimHalo]

looks good but i'm going to go with the consensus and wait for some more concrete evidence

[Canyarion]

I've worked for GC Network. :eek: WhiteStar set it up. It's a terrible site!!

[gekko]

Oh ya, and if this thing is indeed backwards compatible, Nintendo is stupid. It was a stupid idea before PS2 came out, and it proved to be a stupid idea after PS2 was released. Why copy it?

I know Xbox won't do it, since some saves cannot be copied off the HD without illegal devices. And although it's possible to create something to move your saves, it's too complicated to the common consumer, so it just won't happen.

Now, let's see if Nintendo makes a smart decision.

[Jonbo298]

Its better to backward compatible things now then it was 5 years ago because graphics aren't going to have the big jump we saw from the PSX/N64 to the PS2/GC/XB. But if Ninty can throw it in without losing too much money, go ahead. The "mainstream" consumer buys things because of the extra's that it has.

[Jason1]

I dont see why it wouldnt be backwards compatible...I mean, its really not a big deal to me, but I dont see why it wouldnt be compatible with Cube games at least.

[Null]

Oh ya, and if this thing is indeed backwards compatible, Nintendo is stupid. It was a stupid idea before PS2 came out, and it proved to be a stupid idea after PS2 was released. Why copy it?

I know Xbox won't do it, since some saves cannot be copied off the HD without illegal devices. And although it's possible to create something to move your saves, it's too complicated to the common consumer, so it just won't happen.

Now, let's see if Nintendo makes a smart decision.


smart decision would be to do it. they need it. I got 10 that says Xbox 2 will do it.
People wont give a flyin flip if they can get thier saves off, it would mean they already have an Xbox and wouldnt need the backwards compatibility. So its not meant for them. It would be a feature that would draw more people because everyone who didnt have an xbox, gc, ps2, could play the games they always wanted to for cheap without bying the old system.

only downside for MS and Nintendo would be the controller issue because im betting both would like to change certain things on thier controllers.

it was a great thing for PS2, and one of its selling features. ppl who had a PSX could get rid of it and still keep the games. ppl who didnt could have a chance to play em. Plus the graphics are getting to a point where its not a huge downstep anymore to be playin the older systems graphics.

[gekko]

No one does that though. If you have money, you already own the original system. If you're short on money, and you have $50, you're going to buy a new game, not a game that came out 3 years ago that you missed. It's only a good idea on paper, no one actually does that.

The only thing backwards compatibility is good for is saving space on your shelf. And even that idea is shot when PS2 has issues with some games, and with Xbox you can't move saves.

Backwards compatibility was one of the failed ideas of this generation. Don't expect to see it come up again.

[Jason1]

But it works with the Gameboy...

[Ginkasa]

But what about people who have to sell their old consoles to help pay for the new? I'm sure they would rather be able to do that and still play their old favorites along with their new ones.

Is there a site somewhere or something that gives proof as to whether backwards compatibility was a success or failure? It seems it would be better to have proof of it rather than just both sides of the deabte spouting off arguments with nothing to back them up...

*shrugs and walks away*

[Null]

No one does that though. If you have money, you already own the original system. If you're short on money, and you have $50, you're going to buy a new game, not a game that came out 3 years ago that you missed. It's only a good idea on paper, no one actually does that.

The only thing backwards compatibility is good for is saving space on your shelf. And even that idea is shot when PS2 has issues with some games, and with Xbox you can't move saves.

Backwards compatibility was one of the failed ideas of this generation. Don't expect to see it come up again.


ppl do tho. i know you dont. personally i dont. However i do use the backwards compatiblity, after i got My PS2, i gave my Playstation to my young cousin whos parents wont let him go out and spend the money on game systems.
And i will do the same, giving him the PS2 once i get my PS3.

i've seen message boards of ppl who love it that get to go out and buy old games. yes if you have $50, you can go out and buy a new game. However some see it as they have $50, they can go out and buy 5 older games. Its all about choice, people LOVE the idea of freedom, and being able to do something if they wish. This helps in sales whether they use it or not.

If its going to jack up the system price a whole lot it might not be worth it. but if its a simple thing, hell thro it in. thoes things on paper really help when ppl are deciding what to buy. PS2, able to play DVD's and PSX games. you dont think both thoes helped? doesnt matter if they're overly used, they were an easy way to help it out at start. Thats a good thing for them.

[One Winged Angel]

Backward compatibility is genius. I never owned a PS and now that I own my PS2, I've been enjoying PS games along with my PS2. I don't how you can say it's a bad idea.

[Cyrax9]

Ok, the souce may be sketchy as far as Cube Europe goes, but let's say it's right for once.

Why the hell WOULDN'T you want Bakcwards compatibility?!?! The GBC had it, the GBA had it it WORKED and I admit I porbably wouldn't be so keen on new systems if they DIDN'T have it and I knwo peope who bought a PS2 ad sold the PSX because they had games they still wanted to play adn a way to play it. I know people who BOUGHT PS's and wound up BVUYING PSX games they missed so as well qas it works on paper, it also ahs to work in real life, besides anyone who thinks SOny would be as far ahead as they are now without Backwards Compatibility needs to ut the crackpipe down, BC is what's letting SOny pound Nintendo more than anything, geko I'm surpise dyou're one of the poeple NOT agreeing! :eek:


As far as BC goes on Nintendo consoles, think back to the name SUPER NES.l DOes anybody know the REAL REASON Nintendo didn't give this some flashuy name but took the same term of "NES" and slapped the word SUPER in front of it? Time for some enlightement. Yamauchi WANTED BC on the SNES, he WANTED the SNES to PLAY NES GAMES!! Problem: Thye cost was outrageous! $500 USD for that new SNES or Super Famicom in Japan would've sent Nintendo the way of 3DO (WTF is a 3DO anyway we still don't know?) Atari and all the other dismal failures. Yamauchi was RUITHLESSS (What else is new?) about this and did EVERYTING he could THINKO F to make the SNES BC with the NES right to the point of figring people just for stating 'It's not doable" beofre he realized he awas fighitng a loosing war. He then went with the enw non-BC cartridges for the SNES and again, for the N64 which hit the same price tag snag!

We aren't dealing with "Cartsd" anymoe guys, we're using DIsc's, just like Sony and M$. The "It's too expensive" BS Excuse isn't going to fly on the N5, not unless the Big "N" wants to be looking at Chapter 11. The reason the GCN wasn't BC was also due to the stupid cartridge syndrome (SCS) that Yamauchi created. Because the N64 had SCS and Yamauchi woldn't sue OPticxla Tecnology, he shot his own foot and le SOny get away with the whoel CD-ROM deal. Then, to make maters worse after he'd ruined the N64s sales ther wasa an SCS hangover on the Gamecube, because the cartridge slot for an N64 cart on the GCN would've jacked up the cost to an insanely high $300, ABOVE Sony and M$'s prices! Now wehave Optical Disc's we;'ll ahve Opticla Disc's again and BC is going to be aprt of the PS3 and Nintendo knows this, 100 says they'll follow suit, ditto for Microsoft although I'd make it more arund the lines of 50 there.

My only problem wit BC is "That dman GC Controller" as we all know it. The XBox has a giant clucky POS for a controlelr, the PS2 astle the designf rom the SNES, and the GCN st9ole it back and used funky shaped buttons that are a paint to figure out. If Nintendo can design a SIMILAR controller, just a litlte bit LARGER, namely something that doesn'thave my hands pressed intoa sandwhich while playing gams, enlarge the D-Pad and oh, GIVE the D-PAD some PADDING (Thing is so hard it's annoying) It'd be fine, I wouldn't mind if they tok a note form Sony and swapped the location of the Stick and the pad either, because I wuld rather use the Pad over the stick when possible any day.

The N5 controler, if they do anything aside form what was mentioned above, should be fixing the whacky buttons and making them all round a la SNES and using dual "L" and "R" butons a la PS1/PS2, as well as making the controller all Analog a la PS2, a SELECT button wouldn't hurt either for ports of old gamnes, heck, "Z" could dou8ble as SELECT! I mean I like the GCN alot but the controlelr is one of my least favorites, the SNES had the best controlelr for the BIg N on a console, let's use it's general design again like they ddi for the GCN and jsut rework the few "problem areas" of the thing. I mean, the GCN contorller is far beter than the N64's three-handed man design, but it's nowhere near as good as the SNES/PS2 designs Nintendo needs ot stop looking at M$'s controlers adn start loking at Sony's, now, who wants to take best on whether or not Nitnendo and Microsoft will continue the war for the "
Worst Controlelr ever!" award or whether Nitnendo will frrealize how to make the GCN controller a litlte bit beter?

I'm think BC is great, I'm thinkng the controller needs an overhaul though.

[gekko]

Why don't I want it, same reason I didn't want it on PS2, it just took a few years for everyone else to realise it's worthless. When journalists look back on this generation, it will be looked at as a failure, along with Microsoft's first controller, Gamecube's Z-button, Gamecube's discs, and PS2's launch.

First reason not to have it, it's not needed. The people who already own the system can go back and play the games they already own, on the system they already own. News flash, it's already paid for, you are not losing anything by keeping it. Selling a system like PSX when a new backwards compatiable system was just released is going to get you even less money than normal, so why bother? Just hang on to it. Now for the people who didn't own that system, by the time it's successor has been released, the system is pretty much the price of the game. Especially this generation with Gamecube, it could easily be $49.99 when the new system comes out. For the few people who will actually go back and buy old games, they can buy the damn system, too. Most people will not go back and play their old games on a regular basis, and if they do once or twice, good for them, but it's not reason enough to include backwards compatibility.

Second reason not to include it is that it hinders innovation. Look at Xbox, DC, and N64, they all have a multi-feature port on the controller, which is also used for memory cards. What if Sony or Nintendo wanted to do that? Oh wait, they can't. They have memory card card ports on the system that read, well, memory cards. Sony worked around this by adding USB ports for their accesories. Is that the best way to do? Maybe, maybe not. Either way, you're stuck with those damn memory card slots. And say Nintendo decides that they want to include a HD next generation, but still have memory cards for transfering and backing up saves. Say they wanted to use an existing format, nothing proprietary. Say they decide they want to use SD cards, and they just wanted to add a little slot in the controller that you could stick it in. Well they can't exactly do that, because they're stuck with that big fat memory card port from the previous generation. Same if Sony wanted to use their memory sticks. You have the same problem if you want to make radical changes to the controller.

And the third reason not to include it, it costs more money. You think the new Nintendo system will just magically read Gamecube discs? Think again. You'll be paying for a second laser to be included, and then not all the hardware will be compatiable. If the OpenGL used in Gamecube is different than what they use in the new system and they're not compatiable, you will have problems. And if I remember correctly, Sony had to include a PSX processor into PS2 because PS2's processors require unique coding and PSX games won't run on it, even though it had more than enough processing power to handle the game.

If they want to throw in extras, don't put in something when you're entire current userbase already owns in. Put in something that most people don't have yet, like HD-DVD.

[Null]

the memory card senerio makes no sence. they can use whatever they like. for some very ODD reason saves are such a big issue to you. who the hell cares about a damn save? the old games will save on whatever sony wants em to. if they want to work it so the old games save on a differnt mem card. they can. if they want to make em save on the HD, they can. it can be done. they arent stuck with a certain memory card slot or anything.

the controller issue is right. which is what i said MS and nintendo will have that problem because i think they both want to make changes. Sony doesnt have that problem and if sony wants they can add a slot on the controller. that doesnt harm anything.

the cost as i've already said, if its too much to do it may not be worth it. but they have to weigh the price of that vs the money it would bring in. because believe it or not people DO like backwards compatibility and DO use it.

[gekko]

Sony could develop it so that the games save onto a different medium, but you're still stuck with the old **** because people have previous game saves that you have to support.

Sony doesn't have that problem, because they're too stupid to realize a modified 15 year old controller design isn't the best. I'm hoping they're smart enough to change it this generation, but they probably won't.

[Canyarion]

Cyrax please use '.' and ','!!! :( Thanks. :)

I don't think controllers should have all analog buttons. I mean who misses them on the Cube? Who uses them a lot on the others?? :rolleyes:
Perhaps they should make half of the buttons analog, to keep the price down.

BC would be nice and I think it can be done. Perhaps they could sell an adapter to convert your old GCN files to N5 ones...

[gekko]

They're not analog, they're pressure sensetive. I've yet to play a game where they're helpful. GT3 pissed me off when you let up on the button and next thing you know you're being passed up. And I think there was an Xbox game (NFL 2K3?) where the button had to be pushed down real hard before it would read, so a lot of times people just tapped it and it didn't read. Pretty much a useless feature.

Clicking joysticks on the other hand, perfect for FPS.

[Canyarion]

I hate it how in some games you have to press GCN's L and R buttons ALL the way down, for an digital effect! :( Like in 1080 Avalanche, in the beginnening it makes your left finger hurt. :mad: Oh yeah, Zelda TWW has it too.

[Null]

Sony could develop it so that the games save onto a different medium, but you're still stuck with the old **** because people have previous game saves that you have to support.

Sony doesn't have that problem, because they're too stupid to realize a modified 15 year old controller design isn't the best. I'm hoping they're smart enough to change it this generation, but they probably won't.

but you dont have the support previous game saves. if they save on a new game you can start over. no ones going to give a **** as long as you can play the game. i not understanding where you get that the previous saves need to be transfered over. i never used any old psx saves on my ps2.

and no, sony is SMART enough to realize they have the best controller and shouldnt mess with it, controller works perfectly for most any games. which is why its basically the standard now if you go and look for a PC game pad, they all look just like the PS2's. Nintendo should have been smart enough to not drastially change so much from the SNES controller.

[Vampyr]

but you dont have the support previous game saves. if they save on a new game you can start over. no ones going to give a **** as long as you can play the game. i not understanding where you get that the previous saves need to be transfered over. i never used any old psx saves on my ps2.

and no, sony is SMART enough to realize they have the best controller and shouldnt mess with it, controller works perfectly for most any games. which is why its basically the standard now if you go and look for a PC game pad, they all look just like the PS2's. Nintendo should have been smart enough to not drastially change so much from the SNES controller.

Agreed. Why change something that's prefect? The PS2 controller is perfect, it works perfectly for any game. Why mess with it?

I would like it if I could use my old game saves on the new system, but if I cant, I wont be that dissapointed, as long as I can play them.

I dont know about you Gekko, but after so many systems, Im going to get tired of storing all my old one's so that I can play games. For example, when/if the playstation 5 comes out...are you really going to want to store 5 systems to play your old games? I dont think so. It would be so much better to have all 5 systems in one.

A lot less of a hassle to plug them all up, too.

[gekko]

The only thing Sony's controller is perfect for is THPS. It needs analog buttons, and move the d-pad where it belongs. Sony, say hello to the 21st century. We no longer use the d-pad for 99% of games.

And Null, you obviously missed the numerous gamers who had Xbox's with HD failures, and either sold the Xbox, or the game because they didn't want to start over. Many gamers, including myself, don't want to play the game, we want to play OUR game. A lot of today's games (at least with Xbox) are online, and not all the games put everyone on an equal playing field. Don't even think about competing in MotoGP or MotoGP 2 unless you max our your bike stats. Want the good weapons in Ghost Recon? Earn them. Want to race as the Speed 12 in Project Gotham Racing 2? Get all Platinum medals, and there's about 100 of them. No one who has earned all Platinums in PGR2 would ever touch the game with Xbox 2 if they couldn't transfer their saves.

And when PS5 comes out, in the maybe 1 time in 5 years I'll play a PSX game, I'll hook the system up.

[Vampyr]

The only thing Sony's controller is perfect for is THPS. It needs analog buttons, and move the d-pad where it belongs. Sony, say hello to the 21st century. We no longer use the d-pad for 99% of games.

Actually, most of my friends that play video games prefer the D-pad. I prefer the d-pad myself in most occasions. Sometimes a game comes along that requires you to have a lot of maneuvarability, and in these cases I use the analog. But still, I wouldnt move the analog stick or the d-pad for anything. It feels good where its at. And besides, if they did want to move the location of the d-pad to make the analog stick more accessible, then that wouldnt be a problem. It would not affect backwards compatibility at all.

And when PS5 comes out, in the maybe 1 time in 5 years I'll play a PSX game, I'll hook the system up.

Maybe if you didnt have to hook it up, and it was as simple as putting a disk in, you would play it more than 1 time every 5 years. :)

[Null]

that was because they didnt want to start over on a CURRENT game, an old game is completely differnt. i dont play an old game to continue where i left off, by that time id of forgotten what was going on anyway. i play it to play the old game again. and yes, ppl who beat PGR2 would indeed start over 5 years from now if they wanted to play it once again. People are going to want to play it to remember it. in most cases by that time old saves get deleted anyway. no one cares man.

And your still only talking about ppl who already have the old console. theres many more who dont insome cases that want it. IF ITS NOT TOO EXPENSIVE TO ADD ON, IT HELPS THE CONSOLE. some it would cost way too much to do. on thoes it might not be worth it, as i've said.

and i hope to god sony is smart enough to realize not to move the d pad because it IS where it belongs, say hello to comfort Sony, we no longer need the main directional control at upper left. i LOVE that analog stick where it is, infact both of em are perfect. Its one of the most copied controller layouts and for good reason.

[gekko]

Most copied controller layouts?

Positioning of the 4 buttons, taken from SNES.
Position of the left analog stick - Hasn't been copied
Position of the right analog stick - Copied twice
Position of the shoulder buttons - Taken from SNES
Position of the Select/Start buttons - Copied from NES

The PSX controller itself is a modified SNES controller. The only thing that has been copied off of it is the placement of the right analog stick. Unless you're talking about making replicas (ie PC), but what do you expect? It's been the best selling system for the past 10 years. SNES controllers made their way to PC as well.

Now if someone was really clever, they would find a way to make the d-pad and analog stick switchable. Be able to pull it out and turn it around. But either way, the analog stick is the primary means of control for most games out these days, meaning it should be placed in the most natural position.

I just hope Sony doesn't listen to it's fans, because if they do, my god, you'll probably hear me praising Microsoft.

[Null]

Positioning of the 4 buttons, taken from SNES.

check, one part copied.

Position of the left analog stick - Hasn't been copied

go look at PC controllers - check 2 parts copied.

Position of the right analog stick - Copied twice

check, 3 parts copied.

Position of the shoulder buttons - Taken from SNES

check 4 parts copied.

Position of the Select/Start buttons - Copied from NES

check, 5 parts copied.

Then add the 4 shoulder buttons copied, the sticks clicking in copied.

and let me repeat now... the most copied LAYOUT ever.

did i say sony invented it? never.


The PSX controller itself is a modified SNES controller. The only thing that has been copied off of it is the placement of the right analog stick. Unless you're talking about making replicas (ie PC), but what do you expect? It's been the best selling system for the past 10 years. SNES controllers made their way to PC as well.

proving once again the layout is well copied.


Now if someone was really clever, they would find a way to make the d-pad and analog stick switchable. Be able to pull it out and turn it around. But either way, the analog stick is the primary means of control for most games out these days, meaning it should be placed in the most natural position.

interesting idea, but it sounds more breakable that way. and i and most people find that left analog in the most comfortable position as it is. just because when you first picked it up and it didnt feel right and you never bothed to adjust doesnt mean its not good.


I just hope Sony doesn't listen to it's fans, because if they do, my god, you'll probably hear me praising Microsoft.
what would be the difference from now? and sony better listen to its fans because right now they have the most and they love the controller.

oh but wait. they could be like nintendo and tell you what you want instead of listening. :rolleyes:

[Vampyr]

I just hope Sony doesn't listen to it's fans, because if they do, my god, you'll probably hear me praising Microsoft.

:wtf:

If Im not mistaken, thats one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. Funny, I thought that pleasing the customer is what a buisiness is all about? If practically everyone wants the controller to be like it is, and practically everyone wants backwards compatibility, then why would Sony deny them that???

Null is right. Its A LOT better than nintendo, doing to their systems what they want the customer to want.

NOT listening to their fans is really stupid. Its absurd. Give the people what they want. Why would they do otherwise?

[gekko]

Null, PC controllers don't make it a copied design. PC replicates designs. If that's the case, why don't you start counting 3rd party controllers as well?

And Sony's fans are dense and naive. If Sony listens to their fans I'll be buying my 3rd PSX. Whoopie. Go Xbox.

[Null]

Null, PC controllers don't make it a copied design. PC replicates designs. If that's the case, why don't you start counting 3rd party controllers as well?

And Sony's fans are dense and naive. If Sony listens to their fans I'll be buying my 3rd PSX. Whoopie. Go Xbox.


im not talking about the replica controllers. And even then, they sure as hell dont copy the other consoles controllers like they do that one.

but yea. maybe they should tell us we a crappy block to control with instead of whats good. hey, it would be differnt then.