View Full Version : Getting a Mac Laptop
Cyrax9
06-28-2003, 07:16 PM
YES!! I FINALLY COnvinced my parents to make the next "Family PC", not a PC at all, but A MAC!
That's right, my brother has a G4 Tower and now, in addition to my Windoze ME/Linux Dual-Boot Machine which is a WIP, the *new* "Family PC" is going to be a Mac LAPTOP so I can take it on vacation with me, I can also use the iTunes music store instead of a PO2P network, which means I'm clear of any idiots sueing me, and to top it all off, the Laptop will be accessible to everyone in my family, including me, so I'll be able to enjoy it pretty easily.
So far all tha's decided is it's a Laptop, it's a MAC and it's going to replace a Gateway 2000 from 1997.
I'll update ou as I get more details and I can't wait, later VADER! (MAC fans should pick up on this one quickly, as should angry Windoze users)
Stonecutter
06-28-2003, 07:24 PM
Enjoy your limited software support and overpriced hardware!
gekko
06-28-2003, 08:07 PM
Ignoring the obvious idiot here named Stonecutter, congrats!
Going for a PowerBook I hope.
Stonecutter
06-28-2003, 10:08 PM
Ignoring the obvious idiot here named Stonecutter, congrats!
Exsqueeze me?
Macs hardware is priced higher than that of a pc - Fact
Macs have far less software options than pcs - Fact
Care to elaborate on why I'm an "obvious idiot?"
higher priced cuz the hardware is better. they run better. smoother. nicer.
they do have less software. most of which can be made up for in differnt programs tho..
except for games which is why i dont have a mac. games are all for PC. i'll get a mac when the games start all being made for it.
gekko
06-28-2003, 11:11 PM
Care to elaborate on why I'm an "obvious idiot?"
It's self explanitory. If you had any knowledge of Macs, you would understand that. You have made it clear that you're just one of the many ignorant, but very loud-spoken, Mac haters out there. I don't waste my time with people like you.
bobcat
06-28-2003, 11:48 PM
I am still thinking about a Mac Laptop.
One Winged Angel
06-28-2003, 11:51 PM
I'm considering a powerbook. I was thinking about a G5, but the price... nope. I'm hoping the powerbooks are better than Ibooks. Didn't like em that much.
bobcat
06-29-2003, 05:58 PM
I'm considering a powerbook. I was thinking about a G5, but the price... nope. I'm hoping the powerbooks are better than Ibooks. Didn't like em that much.
Powerbooks r better, but obviously more $$$
Cyrax9
06-29-2003, 11:17 PM
Ignoring the obvious idiot here named Stonecutter, congrats!
Going for a PowerBook I hope.
G4 Powerbook Gekko1 can't go wrong, on 1Ghz Proccessor, really for my entre household, but it's perfect to replace this heap.
Also going to get a subscription to the iTunes Mjsic stor to avoid stupid RIAA Lawsuits, and P2P networks.
As far as Stonecutter goes, I see boneheads like this all the time who are too stupid to figure out how to even Eject an External Floppy from a Mac because it's not set at "Retard Level" with a giant button and cumbersome hardware telling him how.
As far as games go, the good stuff is on the Mac or will be on the Mac, the crap is left to Microshaft and DooM III is gonna look d@mn fine on the Powerbook G4, only thing I like more than Mac's are Linux-Based PC's but that's a different story.
Don't worry, if peole like Stonecuttter tried to use a Mac instead of piss on them, they might realize that Windows Sucks, perhaps you should see if "Stonecutter" voted in the poll, then change his vote to the fourth option, sounds like he enjoys serving his "Master" in Readmond WA ;) .
I'm ina good mood,I have parts coming for my new Dual-Boot WinME/Linux PC this week as well as the Mac Laptop.
As for why I'm even keeping Windoze ME, it's an unrefundable copy, and it's not worth my time to smash the Disc nsto a thousand little pieces, rest assured however, that anyone who GIVES me a copy fo XP will find me applying for a Pyrotechnic's lisence to put on a show when destroying the Disc, which I will request be packed into a "firecracker" launched by the local Police that detonates in Red, White, and Blue on the Fourth of July's night sky with the words "Apple Supports Freedom, Microsoft does not!"
Nothing would give me more pleasure than to see the Supreme court get rid of Gate's permentatly.
Oh and to quote another guy I know with a varation on his saying:
~Every time you boot-up WIndows XP, a Devil Gets his Horns~
yes, bill gates has a long thin slimey tail, and reside sin the neatherworld plotting the destruction of the human race, and the only thing that can stop him... is a piece of FRUIT!
Hmm... the Evil Empire is advancing, I'm waiting for Windows SD (StarDestroyer) which is designed to take over the world, Mac OS X-Wing will be the competitor, and the winner ;)
Star Wars fans should get that joke as well.
Stonecutter
06-30-2003, 01:52 AM
G4 Powerbook Gekko1 can't go wrong, on 1Ghz Proccessor, really for my entre household, but it's perfect to replace this heap.
Also going to get a subscription to the iTunes Mjsic stor to avoid stupid RIAA Lawsuits, and P2P networks.
As far as Stonecutter goes, I see boneheads like this all the time who are too stupid to figure out how to even Eject an External Floppy from a Mac because it's not set at "Retard Level" with a giant button and cumbersome hardware telling him how.
As far as games go, the good stuff is on the Mac or will be on the Mac, the crap is left to Microshaft and DooM III is gonna look d@mn fine on the Powerbook G4, only thing I like more than Mac's are Linux-Based PC's but that's a different story.
Don't worry, if peole like Stonecuttter tried to use a Mac instead of piss on them, they might realize that Windows Sucks, perhaps you should see if "Stonecutter" voted in the poll, then change his vote to the fourth option, sounds like he enjoys serving his "Master" in Readmond WA ;) .
I'm ina good mood,I have parts coming for my new Dual-Boot WinME/Linux PC this week as well as the Mac Laptop.
As for why I'm even keeping Windoze ME, it's an unrefundable copy, and it's not worth my time to smash the Disc nsto a thousand little pieces, rest assured however, that anyone who GIVES me a copy fo XP will find me applying for a Pyrotechnic's lisence to put on a show when destroying the Disc, which I will request be packed into a "firecracker" launched by the local Police that detonates in Red, White, and Blue on the Fourth of July's night sky with the words "Apple Supports Freedom, Microsoft does not!"
Nothing would give me more pleasure than to see the Supreme court get rid of Gate's permentatly.
Oh and to quote another guy I know with a varation on his saying:
~Every time you boot-up WIndows XP, a Devil Gets his Horns~
yes, bill gates has a long thin slimey tail, and reside sin the neatherworld plotting the destruction of the human race, and the only thing that can stop him... is a piece of FRUIT!
Hmm... the Evil Empire is advancing, I'm waiting for Windows SD (StarDestroyer) which is designed to take over the world, Mac OS X-Wing will be the competitor, and the winner ;)
Star Wars fans should get that joke as well.
I was going to let sleeping dogs lie but this has gone on far enough.
Lets look at a few "facts" shall we?
No matter what you say about a mac there's one thing that will always come back and bite you square in the ass. $$$ Macs are FAR more expensive than comparably performing PCs, yet whenever you bring this up to a mac fanatic they seem to ignore this fact. Ok fine, I'll play along, lets just pretend for a minute that macs aren't more expensive than PCs.
If money isn't an issue, and we're putting the top G4 against a pc. PCs still own macs in the benchmarks (http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2002/11_nov/reviews/cw_macvspciii.htm) That pc that just pissed all over the G4 is 600$ less than the mac, but money isn't an issue here.
Those are workstation numbers. Would you really like to see what would happen if we put the two head to head in something gaming relevant?
"But.......It doesn't beat the G5!"
THE G5 ISN'T EVEN OUT YET! Honestly, I don't know when the G5 is being released, but going by the usual mac time table pentium will have a hyperthreaded p4 on the market that can outperform the mac before Apple even gets around to releasing its new machine. Even if they don't give them a month. The P4 will be faster, more efficient, and, oh yeah, here it is again, LESS EXPENSIVE!
Lets look at software.
Macs have no options. Yes, you can run all of the windows mainstays. You've got photoshop, and you can play your mp3s and watch your dvds. But when it comes down to options, pcs trump the macs again. You have your iTunes, what if I don't like iTunes? "Oh!" you say "But iTunes is the best" Well, WHAT IF I DON'T THINK SO? There are other mac compatible mp3 players, and there might be 10 more or 100 more or 1,000 more. But guess what. However many other options you have, there are going to be 10 times that amount on the pc. There's so little competition for the mac software, which, once again is going to lead to the price going up as high as apple thinks you're willing to pay.
That goes for just about every single program you can think of. Not to mention games, but as you have zero defense for that one, I'm going to avoid mentioning it.
"Oh, but the OS is so stable, it almost never crashes" Well for Christ sake I should hope it never crashes. Considering everything in the machine is made by the same company. That was really something that macs could brag about before the win2000 kernel came around. PC's running XP crash FAR less than the win98/win95/winME machines. Macs may still have the edge but it's hardly something worth bragging about anymore...
When are you going to upgrade your mac? Well, why don't you look at apple and their timeline. You're not going to have much of a choice other than to follow that. Meanwhile, I can change the components of my pc almost at will.
...because it's not set at "Retard Level"
Hey, "Retard Level?" Let's not forget which company's marketing campaign is completely based around targeting frightened computer neophytes. God forbid you have to push one button to turn on the cpu and one to turn on the monitor and GASP! One MORE to turn on the printer.
Let's look at the most flagrant item of mac ignorance and insecurity.
"No, I live to serve the "Evil Empire" in Readmon, WA and I wave my Micro$oft flag daily."
Lest you not forget that had the "Evil Empire" not purchased $150 million in Apple stock back in the late 90s that your beloved company would have most likely hit the auction block and been broken up so fine, the "Macintosh" name would no longer even been associated with Apple.
PCs outperform the mac, PCs have more software and hardware options and PCs are FAR less expensive. Usually they're all 3 at the same time.
So Cyrax, I assure you Stonecutter is my real forum name (you seem to be less than convinced if your liberal use of the quotation mark is any indication.) I may not be able to convince you to buy a pc, and I sure as hell can't change Gekko's mind, but stop assuming that all pc users are ignorant. Just because you have the income to WASTE on your macintosh doesn't mean everyone else should just fall into line behind you because for 99.9% of the consumer market, the pc IS the better option.
If macs actually were as good as the mac zellots say they are, then they would be the standard. They are not, for a reason.
PureEvil
06-30-2003, 02:03 AM
:rolleyes:
lol
bobcat
06-30-2003, 04:47 AM
lol
:handball:
PuPPeT
06-30-2003, 09:18 AM
Can't we have a new option in the poll which goes some thing like this;
I have a Mac, 2 in fact but never use them as the lack of software F***'s me off! It’s taken 5 versions of Maya to even make me turn my Mac back on.
Maybe
gekko
06-30-2003, 10:35 AM
I was going to let sleeping dogs lie but this has gone on far enough.
Lets look at a few "facts" shall we?
No matter what you say about a mac there's one thing that will always come back and bite you square in the ass. $$$ Macs are FAR more expensive than comparably performing PCs, yet whenever you bring this up to a mac fanatic they seem to ignore this fact. Ok fine, I'll play along, lets just pretend for a minute that macs aren't more expensive than PCs.
If money isn't an issue, and we're putting the top G4 against a pc. PCs still own macs in the benchmarks (http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2002/11_nov/reviews/cw_macvspciii.htm) That pc that just pissed all over the G4 is 600$ less than the mac, but money isn't an issue here.
Those are workstation numbers. Would you really like to see what would happen if we put the two head to head in something gaming relevant?
"But.......It doesn't beat the G5!"
THE G5 ISN'T EVEN OUT YET! Honestly, I don't know when the G5 is being released, but going by the usual mac time table pentium will have a hyperthreaded p4 on the market that can outperform the mac before Apple even gets around to releasing its new machine. Even if they don't give them a month. The P4 will be faster, more efficient, and, oh yeah, here it is again, LESS EXPENSIVE!
Lets look at software.
Macs have no options. Yes, you can run all of the windows mainstays. You've got photoshop, and you can play your mp3s and watch your dvds. But when it comes down to options, pcs trump the macs again. You have your iTunes, what if I don't like iTunes? "Oh!" you say "But iTunes is the best" Well, WHAT IF I DON'T THINK SO? There are other mac compatible mp3 players, and there might be 10 more or 100 more or 1,000 more. But guess what. However many other options you have, there are going to be 10 times that amount on the pc. There's so little competition for the mac software, which, once again is going to lead to the price going up as high as apple thinks you're willing to pay.
That goes for just about every single program you can think of. Not to mention games, but as you have zero defense for that one, I'm going to avoid mentioning it.
"Oh, but the OS is so stable, it almost never crashes" Well for Christ sake I should hope it never crashes. Considering everything in the machine is made by the same company. That was really something that macs could brag about before the win2000 kernel came around. PC's running XP crash FAR less than the win98/win95/winME machines. Macs may still have the edge but it's hardly something worth bragging about anymore...
When are you going to upgrade your mac? Well, why don't you look at apple and their timeline. You're not going to have much of a choice other than to follow that. Meanwhile, I can change the components of my pc almost at will.
Hey, "Retard Level?" Let's not forget which company's marketing campaign is completely based around targeting frightened computer neophytes. God forbid you have to push one button to turn on the cpu and one to turn on the monitor and GASP! One MORE to turn on the printer.
Let's look at the most flagrant item of mac ignorance and insecurity.
"No, I live to serve the "Evil Empire" in Readmon, WA and I wave my Micro$oft flag daily."
Lest you not forget that had the "Evil Empire" not purchased $150 million in Apple stock back in the late 90s that your beloved company would have most likely hit the auction block and been broken up so fine, the "Macintosh" name would no longer even been associated with Apple.
PCs outperform the mac, PCs have more software and hardware options and PCs are FAR less expensive. Usually they're all 3 at the same time.
So Cyrax, I assure you Stonecutter is my real forum name (you seem to be less than convinced if your liberal use of the quotation mark is any indication.) I may not be able to convince you to buy a pc, and I sure as hell can't change Gekko's mind, but stop assuming that all pc users are ignorant. Just because you have the income to WASTE on your macintosh doesn't mean everyone else should just fall into line behind you because for 99.9% of the consumer market, the pc IS the better option.
If macs actually were as good as the mac zellots say they are, then they would be the standard. They are not, for a reason.
Stonecutter, you have once again proved you know nothing about Macs. My advice: Stick to subjects you're educated on.
Now Cyrax, tone it down. I don't care what you think of Stonecutter, don't flame other members. He may not know much about Macs, 96% of the world doesn't and I used to be just like him, but he's not retarded, and I don't know what would make you think he is.
Jonbo298
06-30-2003, 11:49 AM
Mac's are great for people who don't care about games. If I became more of a video editing nut or MP3 nut, a Mac would be great for me. If I had extra money laying around, I would get a Mac since I personally like them more then PC's. But since the PC has such a "monopoly", I have to stick with Windows.:(
Kitana85
06-30-2003, 01:03 PM
Cyrax, wahoo, I'm getting a Mac laptop too! (probably)
I have a '96 Mac and a '01 PC, and quite frankly, my old Mac runs just as well if not better than the PC (the only problem is the lack of space ont he old Mac). A friend of mine has a '83 Mac. Still works, though it's basically a typewriter/E-mail checker.
If you can't have a debate with intelligence and common curtsy involved then just don't debate at all.
That's a warning.
Stonecutter
06-30-2003, 03:53 PM
Stonecutter, you have once again proved you know nothing about Macs. My advice: Stick to subjects you're educated on.
You know something.
Until you actually post something of a worthwhile argument, you haven't proven you know any more about macs than I do.
Either you have a point here, or you're just a mac fanboy who doesn't even have a defense for your machine. In which case Cyrax probably shouldn't be taking advice from you.
gekko
06-30-2003, 03:58 PM
Again...
You have made it clear that you're just one of the many ignorant, but very loud-spoken, Mac haters out there. I don't waste my time with people like you.
manasecret
06-30-2003, 04:03 PM
*sneaks in*
Which I guess means Stonecutter won the debate. If I was an ignorant bystander (which ignorant I may be :p), I'd have to agree with Stonie right now, because his argument seems pretty sound...
:sneaky: *sneaks away*
tis an argument that wont be won by either side.
its the same as people arguing over which console is better.
Macs and PC's both have thier ups and downs.
games software. viraity being on PC's side. while Stability and power beng on macs side.
altho stability is a thing MS IS getting better at. my XP has NEVER had a system crash since i got it a couple years ago. a program might lock up but it dont take down the system with it like in 98 or other versions.
i would gladly get a mac if it had the games and number of software made for PC. and someday that might very well be the case.
altho for right now. im just glad most people dont mindlessly cry and bitch about Windows like cyrax instead of just fixing the problems with it. cryax might have some points if he'd calm himself down and not go overboard trying so hard to think up ways to hate windows. more people would surely listen then.
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 05:28 PM
I have to agree with Stoney. The main reasons I'd not want a MAC are:
a)$$$
b)games
I also agree Null on the fact that windows systems are getting more and more stable. Yes, it was an issue with Win95/98/Me/etc., but it not that big of an issue anymore. My WinXp system has never crashed in the 6 months I've had it. I hate it when Mac advocates still hang on to that issue, cuz with the newer Windows systems there's very little difference with stability between Macs and PCs.
Oh well, I know nobody's gonna win this argument, so I won't say anything more.
well i wouldnt say very little difference.
the mac computers do communicate with devices/hardware and Programs/software much smoother and easier then windows/pc.
its just windows IS getting better. its not totally there yet.
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 05:53 PM
Well yeah, I didn't want to make it sound like there was no difference. Just that it's not nearly the same as the Win95/98 generation.
Xantar
06-30-2003, 05:59 PM
My mom has a computer with Windows XP that my brother uses when she's off at work. It's probably a year old by now. I only know what it's been doing this summer since that's when I'm home.
Anyway, we've had two blue screens of death this summer. And all we've been doing is using Kazaa...
Also, even though this computer is a Dell with a 1.8 Ghz Pentium 4 with 512 MB of RAM, it generally behaves slower than my 450 Mhz G4. Maybe Windows XP is clunkier than Mac OS?
Or maybe Dell makes crappy computers?
My mom has a computer with Windows XP that my brother uses when she's off at work. It's probably a year old by now. I only know what it's been doing this summer since that's when I'm home.
Anyway, we've had two blue screens of death this summer. And all we've been doing is using Kazaa...
Also, even though this computer is a Dell with a 1.8 Ghz Pentium 4 with 512 MB of RAM, it generally behaves slower than my 450 Mhz G4. Maybe Windows XP is clunkier than Mac OS?
Or maybe Dell makes crappy computers?
That's hard to believe. I'm not saying you're lying. It's just, I've put my PC through so much stuff, unstable programs and gaming out of my ears. Not one blue screen. I'm running a P4 2.4 with 512mb RAM and i've had it since last July. But whatever.
I can see why a lot of people like macs. They're fun machines. If i got into 3D modeling and media stuff then i might buy one. Too expensive and gaming support is virtually nill. Mac's getting HALO atleast right?
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 06:13 PM
My mom has a computer with Windows XP that my brother uses when she's off at work. It's probably a year old by now. I only know what it's been doing this summer since that's when I'm home.
Anyway, we've had two blue screens of death this summer. And all we've been doing is using Kazaa...
Also, even though this computer is a Dell with a 1.8 Ghz Pentium 4 with 512 MB of RAM, it generally behaves slower than my 450 Mhz G4. Maybe Windows XP is clunkier than Mac OS?
Or maybe Dell makes crappy computers?
First: I'd like to say that you're asking for a blue screen of death if you use kazaa. That thing is so full of viruses, worms, ads, etc.. I mean, I use Norton anti-virus 2003 (keeping it updated) and I get virus warnings from Kazaa Lite too often to count. And some viruses have slipped through and done some s*** to my comp. That was the last time I ever used Kazaa.
Second: IMO, Dell makes crappy computers, lol. Same with Gateway, I can't stand Gateway. 4 out of every 5 computers I fix are Gateways.
manasecret
06-30-2003, 06:17 PM
Xantar:
I bet a whole $100 that your mom doesn't know how to treat the computer. I had a Win 98 machine a while back which worked almost flawlessly except for the usual Blue Screens inherent with Win 98. But I gave it to my parents after building a new one with XP (which runs perfectly), and now a year later the Win 98 machine is wasted. They had to buy a new hard drive and start over!
My mom has a computer with Windows XP that my brother uses when she's off at work. It's probably a year old by now. I only know what it's been doing this summer since that's when I'm home.
Anyway, we've had two blue screens of death this summer. And all we've been doing is using Kazaa...
Also, even though this computer is a Dell with a 1.8 Ghz Pentium 4 with 512 MB of RAM, it generally behaves slower than my 450 Mhz G4. Maybe Windows XP is clunkier than Mac OS?
Or maybe Dell makes crappy computers?
Win XP does not have a blue screen......... at all.
the blue screen is a Dos screen. XP does not have a dos. it doesnt use dos. closest it has is a simulated dos mod.
only blue screen is the welcome and shut down screens. and even them arent the same blue screen as what your talking about.
IF XP did lock up all it would do is have an error box or something. it wont flick into a dos blue screen tho.
First: I'd like to say that you're asking for a blue screen of death if you use kazaa. That thing is so full of viruses, worms, ads, etc.. I mean, I use Norton anti-virus 2003 (keeping it updated) and I get virus warnings from Kazaa Lite too often to count. And some viruses have slipped through and done some s*** to my comp. That was the last time I ever used Kazaa.
Second: IMO, Dell makes crappy computers, lol. Same with Gateway, I can't stand Gateway. 4 out of every 5 computers I fix are Gateways.
You took the words right out of my mouth Yoda. Couldn't have said it better.
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 06:29 PM
I bet a whole $100 that your mom doesn't know how to treat the computer.
That's something I really hate. When people don't respect there computers.
I want to slap people in the face when they ask me why their computer doesn't work, and when I look at their desktop, 50 programs like Gator are installed and all are running in the system tray. I mean seriously people, what do you expect when you install all those stupid little programs that nobody has heard of from some backwater internet site??
Xantar
06-30-2003, 06:31 PM
Win XP does not have a blue screen......... at all.
the blue screen is a Dos screen. XP does not have a dos. it doesnt use dos. closest it has is a simulated dos mod.
only blue screen is the welcome and shut down screens. and even them arent the same blue screen as what your talking about.
IF XP did lock up all it would do is have an error box or something. it wont flick into a dos blue screen tho.
Well, I saw a screen with a blue background and white letters saying, "A fatal error occurred" etc. What else do I call it?
Ok, there were a lot more words than in a normal blue screen. There were three paragraphs of stuff. But it was still a blue screen of death.
Maybe I should defrag that hard drive...
Originall posted by Yoda9864
That's something I really hate. When people don't respect there computers.
I want to slap people in the face when they ask me why their computer doesn't work, and when I look at their desktop, 50 programs like Gator are installed and all are running in the system tray. I mean seriously people, what do you expect when you install all those stupid little programs that nobody has heard of from some backwater internet site??
My mom uses that computer for Excel only (she's an accountant). So I highly doubt she's been installing Gator on it.
As for my brother and me, we've put Kazaa and Mozilla Firebird on the computer. Oh, and some game demos. We're cheap bastards.
hmmmmmmmmmmm
theres an all blue screen for Scan Disk. it says a lot and scans a whole bunch. but i wouldnt see how that would pop up outa no where
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 06:40 PM
My mom uses that computer for Excel only (she's an accountant). So I highly doubt she's been installing Gator on it.
As for my brother and me, we've put Kazaa and Mozilla Firebird on the computer. Oh, and some game demos. We're cheap bastards.
I wasn't refering to you Xantar. Just the ignorant people in my neighborhood.
actually. gator installs itself when you put normal Kazaa on.
kazaa lite dont have it.
gekko
06-30-2003, 07:44 PM
Also, even though this computer is a Dell with a 1.8 Ghz Pentium 4 with 512 MB of RAM, it generally behaves slower than my 450 Mhz G4. Maybe Windows XP is clunkier than Mac OS?
Doesn't surprise me. My 2.53ghz P4 seems to run at the same speed, and occasionally slower than my 733mhz G4. The P4 is a more powerful machine, but doesn't seem to run any faster. Don't know the cause of it. Adds a lot of life to the computer though.
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 07:59 PM
Doesn't surprise me. My 2.53ghz P4 seems to run at the same speed, and occasionally slower than my 733mhz G4. The P4 is a more powerful machine, but doesn't seem to run any faster. Don't know the cause of it. Adds a lot of life to the computer though.
I'm just curious, are we talking speed during games, or during Word, Excel, file searching, etc.?
gekko
06-30-2003, 08:14 PM
Pretty much everything but games. I don't play games on my Mac. The P4 would blow it away in games, as it should with a faster processor, bus, and better video card. But I was referring to everything but games.
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 08:21 PM
Ok, that's what I figured. That's the main reason I like PC's better than Mac's, gaming. Other than that and price, I guess I really don't have anything against Macs. And I have to say that I like video editing on Macs.
Kitana85
06-30-2003, 09:12 PM
I'm glad everyone is so ummm, interested in this thread, but um, could people please tone it down a bit, no bashing etc. I really don't want to have to close this thread, people, PLEASE calm down.
Thank you, and good night.
I'm glad everyone is so ummm, interested in this thread, but um, could people please tone it down a bit, no bashing etc. I really don't want to have to close this thread, people, PLEASE calm down.
Thank you, and good night.
must be boring being mod of this section.... lol. you look like your trying to find a place to assert power. :P
not sure what your speaking of tho. aside from one post. which was taken care of a while ago.
the descussion is going quite nicely.
Yes, this discussion has actually been going much better than the past few we've had in recent days.
manasecret
06-30-2003, 09:47 PM
Someone mentioned it but I forgot who. Anyway, even plug-and-play has become a lot better with XP than it used to be.
For example, I plugged in an old printer awhile ago into a printer port (not USB), and XP installed the driver itself and it worked great.
Also, every USB product I've ever used with XP automatically brings up software for it or XP lets me look at the files or whatever. Admittedly, I don't use many USB devices, so has anyone else had more experience with that?
I also like how XP will find drivers for me on the internet if I don't know where they are. Or XP will automatically find updates to many of the current drivers I use, like for soundcards and such.
With all of that, a more friendly look and interface than the Win 9x series, and a very stable OS makes me love XP.
yes it does find the drivers and stuff for USB devices quite well.
it even found all the drivers needed for my Apple iPod when i plugged that into my firewire. before i installed the stuff that came with the iPod.
as i said. getting better. :p
Mushlafa
06-30-2003, 10:14 PM
Win XP does not have a blue screen......... at all.
the blue screen is a Dos screen. XP does not have a dos. it doesnt use dos. closest it has is a simulated dos mod.
only blue screen is the welcome and shut down screens. and even them arent the same blue screen as what your talking about.
IF XP did lock up all it would do is have an error box or something. it wont flick into a dos blue screen tho.
Ive gotten a blue screen in XP when i broke something with my virus scanning software... during XP boot it went into a blue screen with white writing and about 3 paragraphs.. telling me that i had an unmountable boot volume.. took me a while to fix the damn thing seeing as i didnt have an xp cd... ya.. im done..
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 10:16 PM
yes it does find the drivers and stuff for USB devices quite well.
it even found all the drivers needed for my Apple iPod when i plugged that into my firewire. before i installed the stuff that came with the iPod.
as i said. getting better. :p
Lol
yes thats the scandisk....... not in dos. they just colored it blue for the hell of it. heh. but thats not a 'blue screen of death'
i've never seen xp pop up with any type of blue screen in the middle of using it. and i dont know why they would want to make it do that. when windows ran on dos it made sence. it had no other way to do anything but something in dos.
Stonecutter
06-30-2003, 11:09 PM
Pretty much everything but games. I don't play games on my Mac. The P4 would blow it away in games, as it should with a faster processor, bus, and better video card. But I was referring to everything but games.
People who have actually bothered to run the benchmarks would disagree. (http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2002/11_nov/reviews/cw_macvspciii.htm)
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-6/258536/dellvmac.jpg
Yoda9864
06-30-2003, 11:32 PM
Good God, the Mac got slaughtered. Has anyone else done a duel like this? I don't like trusting just one site.
Stonecutter
07-01-2003, 12:05 AM
Good God, the Mac got slaughtered. Has anyone else done a duel like this? I don't like trusting just one site.
This is about a month old, but they're testing similar machines.
http://www.barefeats.com/pentium4.html
That's a pro-mac site and one of the pcs wins all but one of the benchmarks (they test a P4 and a xeon.)
http://www.macmusic.org/news/viewnews.php/id/781/?vRmtQjpAznOhM=1
These are mac enthusiasts slamming Jobbs & Co. for their questionable at best standards when they put the G5 against the top P4 at WWDC.
http://www.macobserver.com/columns/devilsadvocate/2003/20030509.shtml
http://pcbuyersguide.com/software/system/WinXP_benchmarks.html
Edit: sorry if the order is a little confusing. All of those are good pc v mac stories.
Yoda9864
07-01-2003, 12:35 AM
Wait a minute, so Jobs tried to compare the two systems using different programs on each comp? What the hell is he smoking?
Stonecutter
07-01-2003, 12:45 AM
Wait a minute, so Jobs tried to compare the two systems using different programs on each comp? What the hell is he smoking?
Perhaps it's the "We can't win in a fair fight" bong.
He's certianly not alone. If you don't think ATI AND Nvidia aren't skewing their benchmarks in their favor I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.
Well, in the past whenever Apple would conduct a test, they would always favor the Mac. But actually the latest one they did with the G4 vs. P4 and Xeon favored the P4 and Xeon.
gekko
07-01-2003, 11:34 AM
People who have actually bothered to run the benchmarks would disagree. (http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2002/11_nov/reviews/cw_macvspciii.htm)
Good for them. You haven't used either system, so you wouldn't know, would you?
These are mac enthusiasts slamming Jobbs & Co. for their questionable at best standards when they put the G5 against the top P4 at WWDC.
Wow, a shock to you? Maybe you should spend less time trying to learn from fanboy flame wars and spend some time with the Mac community. Mac fans are very critical of Apple, much in the same way Nintendo fans can be fed perfection and they still complain. Apple fans always have, and always will be critical of whatever Apple does. You would know that if you visited Mac sites.
If you want some real information, take it from someone who actually knows about the tests, and not some PC fanboy pulling **** out of their ass.
http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/06/24/2154256&mode=thread&tid=126&tid=181
Stonecutter, until you actually own and use a Mac in the same way you use your PC, you can't accuratly compare Macs and PCs. So until that time comes, you have no first hand knowledge and everything you say is nothing but regergetated bull**** from someone else's mouth. You've established your identity as an PC fanboy who finds happiness in life by winning PC vs. Mac debates. If you actually used both platforms and like the PC better, I would respect you and value your opinion. Until that time, your opinion is worthless, and I'm not going to waste my time with someone who is not educated on the subject and enjoys flamewars.
So continue trying to brainwash people like Yoda, they'll believe everything you say. I don't plan on stopping the spread of communism. But until you actually educate yourself on the Mac platform, I'm not going to waste my time debating with you. It'll just be interesting to see how many people actually believe you.
GiMpY-wAnNaBe
07-01-2003, 02:02 PM
mmmmm.... hard to fight the PC side is :rolleyes:
*sry yoda, i just had to say that :p
Stonecutter
07-01-2003, 03:58 PM
If you want some real information, take it from someone who actually knows about the tests, and not some PC fanboy pulling **** out of their ass.
http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/06/24/2154256&mode=thread&tid=126&tid=181
So we should listen to the largest, most notorious anti-microsoft website on the net.
In an article written with all relevant information being given by an apple employee no less.
Right.
Not to mention the fact that they're trying to prove that the G5, a computer with technology two months ahead of the current intel is the better machine. Again, I should hope it is. The G5 should be whipping the P4 right now, though it's advantages would be marginal at best and non-existent at worse.
Not to mention the price, which you still have no answer for.
Stonecutter, until you actually own and use a Mac in the same way you use your PC, you can't accuratly compare Macs and PCs. So until that time comes, you have no first hand knowledge and everything you say is nothing but regergetated bull**** from someone else's mouth. You've established your identity as an PC fanboy who finds happiness in life by winning PC vs. Mac debates. If you actually used both platforms and like the PC better, I would respect you and value your opinion. Until that time, your opinion is worthless, and I'm not going to waste my time with someone who is not educated on the subject and enjoys flamewars.
So continue trying to brainwash people like Yoda, they'll believe everything you say. I don't plan on stopping the spread of communism. But until you actually educate yourself on the Mac platform, I'm not going to waste my time debating with you. It'll just be interesting to see how many people actually believe you.
So... basicly, what you're saying is. "I like the mac better and everyone who dosen't agree is a pc fanboy/moron. I don't have any numbers to back it up, but don't pay any attention to his numbers because..."
Where I'm saying the PC is better and I have the numbers to back it up.
I've taken the time to read the specs, to look at the prices to look at the software.
But I'm not educated on the subject because I haven't used it myself.
Interesting. I'd think that lack of first hand education would take about 90% of everything everyone learns in school and throw it out the window. That stance is the same kind of arrogance that professional atheletes show when they attack the media for "never having played the game." It doesn't work. Your only arguement so far is "I like them better."
It will be far more interesting to see how many people believe you, because you have no information to believe. Only your opinion that the mac is better. Despite the facts which tend to show the opposite.
I believe it's around 96% of the computer market that tends to agree with me.
Stonecutter, until you actually own and use a Mac in the same way you use your PC, you can't accuratly compare Macs and PCs.
Actually, I used macs for two years in grade school before my school got some donated pcs. I have no idea what we were using (on either the pc or the mac front) but because we were so short on funds I can almost guarantee that the macs we owned were still better (specs wise) than the piecemeal pcs we were given and I have preferred the pc since that time. I will admit that even now the majority of the machines in that school are P2s meaning the mac/pc experience I have is a war that was fought many years past but I did make a mac pc decision. At the time I didn't know there was actually a difference. It was one computer that I liked a whole lot better than the other one.
gekko
07-01-2003, 05:14 PM
So we should listen to the largest, most notorious anti-microsoft website on the net.
In an article written with all relevant information being given by an apple employee no less.
Right.
Not to mention the fact that they're trying to prove that the G5, a computer with technology two months ahead of the current intel is the better machine. Again, I should hope it is. The G5 should be whipping the P4 right now, though it's advantages would be marginal at best and non-existent at worse.
Not to mention the price, which you still have no answer for.
Well let's take a look at things...
Do any of these anti-Mac sites have a G5? No. That means no one outside of Apple and Veritest can tell you how good or bad the G5 is. Any PC sites, or PC fans saying the G5 is slower is purely biased, because they don't have one.
Should you trust Apple's VP? Yes. Apple's innocent until proven guilty. He has first hand knowledge of how the tests were done. Do any skeptics? No, they immediatly assume Apple cheated because to them it's impossible for Apple to have a faster machine. They are what we call biased. Apple even offered to re-do the tests, something no company would do if they were not 100% confident the results would be even better.
Can Apple test Intel's machine that's shipping in 2 months? No. Will that machine be better than the G5? Maybe, maybe not. Wait and see. Technology keeps advancing. Intel may pass the G5, AMD may come back and pass both. It's no big deal to Mac users. G4s were much slower than the PC processors, and they kept falling farther and farther behind. Now the G5 is a competetor, and that's all that matters.
As for price, the G5 they tested cost less than the PC they tested. Also, to save you the research, top-of-the-line Macs do not cost much more than top-of-the-line PCs. Thing is, most people who complain about the cost of Macs never buy a top-of-the-line PC. I bought a top-of-the-line Mac in Feb 2001, cost me $700 more than a top-of-the-line PC (except video card, will be explained later) I bought May 2002. The Mac has a DVD burner, PC does not. The Mac has Gigabit ethernet, the PC does not. The Mac has wireless networking, the PC does not. The Mac has FireWire, the PC does not. The Mac also had the top-end video card of the day, the PC was one level down (GF4 Ti4400 instead of 4600). Anyone who jumps on the technology is going to pay big bucks for it. Price is a stereotype against Macs, and it's dropped considerably in the past few years. It's an argument made by the same PC users showing benchmarks for the best PC on the market and saying how much better PCs are. Give me a break, if you can afford the best PC on the market, price is not your concearn.
Actually, I used macs for two years in grade school before my school got some donated pcs. I have no idea what we were using (on either the pc or the mac front) but because we were so short on funds I can almost guarantee that the macs we owned were still better (specs wise) than the piecemeal pcs we were given and I have preferred the pc since that time. I will admit that even now the majority of the machines in that school are P2s meaning the mac/pc experience I have is a war that was fought many years past but I did make a mac pc decision.
Most people only use Macs in school, and they wonder why Macs suck. My school got new iMacs this last year, which just happened to be 2 years old to begin with. Slow? I would've never guessed.
And that's exactly why I said "own and use a Mac in the same way you use your PC, you can't accuratly compare Macs and PCs." Using a computer outside of your home is entirely different than using one in your home. If you owned and used a Mac at home (by Mac I mean a recent Mac, running OS X 10.2) and you still liked PCs better, I would be happy to debate with you. See, I'm a Mac fan, but behind me is a very nice Windows machine. I know both platforms because I own both, and have used both for years (Macs for 3 years, Windows since 3.1). I don't like debating with PC fans. Why? Because they're Mac-hating fanboys who love to talk about how much Macs suck when they've never used them outside of school and they don't know anything about them except what they've read in debates. How do I know? I was one. Then I bought a Mac.
Stonecutter
07-01-2003, 05:33 PM
Well let's take a look at things...
Do any of these anti-Mac sites have a G5? No. That means no one outside of Apple and Veritest can tell you how good or bad the G5 is. Any PC sites, or PC fans saying the G5 is slower is purely biased, because they don't have one.
Should you trust Apple's VP? Yes. Apple's innocent until proven guilty. He has first hand knowledge of how the tests were done. Do any skeptics? No, they immediatly assume Apple cheated because to them it's impossible for Apple to have a faster machine. They are what we call biased. Apple even offered to re-do the tests, something no company would do if they were not 100% confident the results would be even better.
Can Apple test Intel's machine that's shipping in 2 months? No. Will that machine be better than the G5? Maybe, maybe not. Wait and see. Technology keeps advancing. Intel may pass the G5, AMD may come back and pass both. It's no big deal to Mac users. G4s were much slower than the PC processors, and they kept falling farther and farther behind. Now the G5 is a competetor, and that's all that matters.
As for price, the G5 they tested cost less than the PC they tested. Also, to save you the research, top-of-the-line Macs do not cost much more than top-of-the-line PCs. Thing is, most people who complain about the cost of Macs never buy a top-of-the-line PC. I bought a top-of-the-line Mac in Feb 2001, cost me $700 more than a top-of-the-line PC (except video card, will be explained later) I bought May 2002. The Mac has a DVD burner, PC does not. The Mac has Gigabit ethernet, the PC does not. The Mac has wireless networking, the PC does not. The Mac has FireWire, the PC does not. The Mac also had the top-end video card of the day, the PC was one level down (GF4 Ti4400 instead of 4600). Anyone who jumps on the technology is going to pay big bucks for it. Price is a stereotype against Macs, and it's dropped considerably in the past few years. It's an argument made by the same PC users showing benchmarks for the best PC on the market and saying how much better PCs are. Give me a break, if you can afford the best PC on the market, price is not your concearn.
Most people only use Macs in school, and they wonder why Macs suck. My school got new iMacs this last year, which just happened to be 2 years old to begin with. Slow? I would've never guessed.
And that's exactly why I said "own and use a Mac in the same way you use your PC, you can't accuratly compare Macs and PCs." Using a computer outside of your home is entirely different than using one in your home. If you owned and used a Mac at home (by Mac I mean a recent Mac, running OS X 10.2) and you still liked PCs better, I would be happy to debate with you. See, I'm a Mac fan, but behind me is a very nice Windows machine. I know both platforms because I own both, and have used both for years (Macs for 3 years, Windows since 3.1). I don't like debating with PC fans. Why? Because they're Mac-hating fanboys who love to talk about how much Macs suck when they've never used them outside of school and they don't know anything about them except what they've read in debates. How do I know? I was one. Then I bought a Mac.
And I got a response out of you other than "you're an idiot."
Which is all I really wanted.
So though I still feel I won. I shall tip my cap to you.
Good day, sir.
PureEvil
07-01-2003, 05:35 PM
And I got a response out of you other than "you're an idiot."
Which is all I really wanted.
So though I still feel I won. I shall tip my cap to you.
Good day, sir.
You're an idiot.
Stonecutter
07-01-2003, 05:38 PM
Ohhhh, we were getting alone so well for about 3 days.
:rolleyes:
Edit: Or, along, for that matter.
GameMaster
07-01-2003, 05:41 PM
I have a Mac. I like it a lot. :)
Mushlafa
07-01-2003, 09:29 PM
I dont have a mac but id like one... just for the hell of it :unsure: I prolly wouldnt use it much tho cuz i mainly use my comp for gaming, so blah
*walks away*
Kitana85
07-02-2003, 08:58 AM
And I got a response out of you other than "you're an idiot."
Which is all I really wanted.
So though I still feel I won. I shall tip my cap to you.
Good day, sir.
You're an idiot.
Ah, this is mature... :rolleyes:
perhaps not. but amusing tho. ;)
Yoda9864
07-03-2003, 02:29 PM
So continue trying to brainwash people like Yoda, they'll believe everything you say.
That hurts Gekko. So I ask for more tests between Pc's and Macs to justify a shady little site's test, and all of a sudden I believe everything I see and am brainwashed?
sdtPikachu
07-06-2003, 01:18 PM
/me ignores flames and casually walks in
Yes, I'd love a Mac laptop. No, Macs aren't the fastest in the world (I'm talking the G4's here chaps, not the spanky new 970's) but FFS, this is a laptop we're talking about, right?
Reasons I love Mac laptops (and yes, I have used them):
Really really nice screens
Battery life that puts x86 machines to shame
Better PnP support
All the apps I'd ever need for wandering about
UNIX core (which comes in fscking handy since I then don't have to arse about with dual booting yellow dog linux on it)
Apple HW may sometimes be more expensive than x86 stuff, granted. But AFAIK, when you consider the TCO I find Mac's work out cheaper, as I don't have to spend an age fixing Windows when it fsck's itself over for the zillionth time, or trying to recover my b0rked kernel recompile in Linux.
And just top settle an earlier point of discussion, I've seen plenty of XP bluescreens. And I still find it far less reliable than 2k.
As far as laptops go, I just can't see a better option than the Macs - they're the best for carting about and doing general stuff. If I want to play games, I'll do it on my Windows box. If I want to render movies, I'll start up Linux on my renderbox. If I want to chill and listen to some music or watch some TV and films, I'll go fire up the MythTV in the lounge. It's all about choosing the best applications for the job kids, and as far as I can see Mac's have my interest in laptops owned.
Cyrax9
07-07-2003, 03:16 AM
PIka to the rescue!!
Thank you Sagre! I am enjoying my mac, while my idiot father can't get Winblows 98 Scrap Edition, to work with MOve2Mac, apparently his K-rappy DVD-ROM Drive is too old to "handle" the M2M Disc, and he's curisng it out, his loss, besides if he keeps complang about it I'm going to ask for "My Mac" and tell him to Scr*w of sicne he ppaently doesn't want it, ona brighter note, my Ol' "Co Computer" that I laoned to my rbother for awhile (You do known what I mean by Cow Computer I hope, rioght?) and my Alineware Machine, can BOTH apparenlty read the MOve2Mac CD so as I told the Arse with the wallet (aka my Father), "It's NOT the MOve2Mac Software, it's YOUR Hardware", now tomorw I'm going to try and see if I can get the scrapheap to work with the M2M software, if I can't oh well, but at least it proves Windoze sucks for everything excpet Gaming, and right now the only PC Gaming I want to do, I can do From Windows ME, ncluding DooM III and The Sims 2 when i cmes out, SuXP crashes more often than a drunk driver, and sicne I'm stuck with Wuindows ME for awhile due to a Non-Refundabl Cpy, I'll dual-boot it with Linuxm, for Vid editng, and I'll play games through ME since I prefer DOS Games anyway if I;'m not,play my 'Cube or anohter Console, and as far as the Mac goes, it's Replacing Windoze since the Empire seems to enjoy taking over the planet, anybody wanna make an Xbox controller? (SOmebody PLEASE find that vdieo!) Because atthis rate, as my Aunt's IT Departmern would say, in 2 years everyoe will be woring fomr microsoft SOMEHOW, sadly unless The Horned man who resides in the neatherworld ebtween Washington State and the core of the earth is gone, we have no choice but to put up with MIcorshatft, and yes I liek to cll Micorsoft Microshaft bncause these guys have cheated me time and again, and Whoever it was at Xerox that gave Bill gates WIndozer should be taken onto the Gallows and shot for crimes against humanity, Xerox shouldda kept that piece of garbge where it ws, in the Garbage!
Who here has Wiundows CE, WIndows ME adn Windows NT? IF you \do, try using them togethr to make Whndows CEMENT! Hey ther's an diea,a "Serive Pack" for threee cheesy OS' that's aptly named, just wait until I mkae a post about ""WIndows Vs. A Window" we';re gonna have soem fun with that, and I'm sure Geko will enjoy it, with that siad, I'm out of this flame war because my flame-reatrdant sut is starting to get a little hot, gotta tarde up tot he model, buil by the guys at Microshaft ;)
Stonecutter
07-09-2003, 07:52 PM
http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2002/20020712l.gif
Says it all.
GiMpY-wAnNaBe
07-09-2003, 07:59 PM
lol, reminds or something i can't remember. :D
why can't we all just live in a world where macs and pcs get along, where users can graciously appreciate eachothers stuff, and in this world gimpy said let there be peace, and there was, and for a time, it was good. but then the awesome power of the Xeon struck, threatened out of existence, the Apple unleashed the G5 an awsome force with large amounts of ram and CPU processing power, and gimpy said it was good, and so it was :D
GameMaster
07-09-2003, 10:25 PM
On July 12, Apple is opening a new store up 10 minutes away from where I live! The first 1000 people get an Apple T-shirt! I'm am so going to be there early. :D
One Winged Angel
07-09-2003, 11:08 PM
thats pathetic :P
manasecret
07-09-2003, 11:33 PM
Gimpy, this world wouldn't be fun if we all got along.
And we got an Apple store opened her about a year ago. There was a grand opening. I didn't go. Yeah, that's right; you can be jealous :p.
GiMpY-wAnNaBe
07-10-2003, 09:14 AM
On July 12, Apple is opening a new store up 10 minutes away from where I live! The first 1000 people get an Apple T-shirt! I'm am so going to be there early. :D
lol, i can just imagine the advertisement
FREE APPLE Tshirt
gekko
07-10-2003, 10:29 AM
On July 12, Apple is opening a new store up 10 minutes away from where I live! The first 1000 people get an Apple T-shirt! I'm am so going to be there early. :D
That's not exactly a good thing. I didn't go to the Mall of America grand opening, but I had a friend who did. Huge line and the store was packed.
I did go to the Jaguar launch though. Well over 1,000 people there, and I got a free mouse pad just for going, and t-shirt for buying :D Granted it was the most tedius experience of my life, I got a mouse pad and a t-shirt!
http://www.gametavern.net/forums/showthread.php?t=3154
Warning (Achtung!): NEVER ATTEND AN APPLE EVENT!
They opened a second store only about 10 minutes from the Mall of America. When asked why, they said the largest concentration of Mac users in the world live in that area. Sweet :cool:
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