WWE Discussion

[nWoCHRISnWo]

I've sat through 1995 WWF, I've sat through the dieing days of WCW, but the current WWE is the worst I've ever seen. It's just plain not entertaining. I almost wanna quit watching, but I watch out of habit.

Random thoughts/Rant~ Let me start off with Bad Blood. What a horrible PPV. It seemed like an extended Raw for ****s sake, although not too extended, it was only a little more than 2 and a half hours. And they even cut a match from the PPV. But I'm glad it didn't go 3 hours because I couldn't have sit through that **** for any longer.

Triple H vs Nash was okay, I won't complain too much about it, but for a HIAC it wasn't special at all. One of the worst HIAC's actually. Probably the most anti-climatic finish I've ever seen. I liked Flair/HBK, but others could have taken their place as I'll talk about in a moment. Jericho/Goldberg was about average, but everyone knew the outcome ahead of time so it wasn't very suspenful or anything. Looks like someone taught Goldberg a few moves, he did more than 3.

And then there was the torture that was the rest of the PPV. Austin/Bischoff Redneck Triathlon? Does anyone seriously give a **** about that? The burping contest wasn't funny in the slightest bit, and looked to be aimed towards five year old kids. The pie eating contest was so amazingly predictable it wasn't even funny. It's Mae Young, gee I didn't see that coming from a miles away. The whole thing was a predictable, unentertaining, giant waste of half a ****ing hour. It's pay-per-view, people have to PAY for this. Shouldn't it like, you know, NOT SUCK?

And I thought the point of having seperate brands was to showcase newer talent? I saw a lot of Triple H, Nash, Flair, HBK, etc. but I certainly didn't see Hurricane, I didn't see Lance Storm either. Which brings me to last night's Raw. Austin comes out and yells BORING about 50 times and says Lance Storm is the boringest son of a bitch he's ever seen. I'd love to believe that this is going to be the beginning of a ravamping period for Lance, but I bet 10 bucks it was just done to publically humiliate Lance because he apparently wasn't happy about having his entrance not shown on TV with his match with Steiner last week, and wasn't happy about the match being cut down to a squash. They'll probably fire Storm soon too. I this is bull****. It's NEVER a good idea to just blatantly say that one of their wrestlers is boring. Why don't they just tell the crowd that they charge way too much for PPV's, and that their product isn't worth watching while they're at it? I bet Austin starting a "Boring, boring" chant will backfire in WWE's face too. The fans could be chanting boring for almost every match from now on, like how they still say "WHAT" a lot. And if WWE really thinks Lance is that horrible, then they should blame themselves. WC****ingW, in it's worst days, made Lance Storm look awesome. He was over as hell, having entertaining matches, and people cared about him.

Anyways, the future doesn't look any better at all. The fans chanted for Y2J in his match against Goldberg, he's a good wrestler, a master mic worker, been in the business for a while now, but that doesn't matter. Nash comes in, gets booed (while being a face) out of most venues he appeared in, didn't even appear at most of the shows leading up to his main event match, had a couple ****ty matches, barely said anything on the mic, is a proven ratings disaster, so he automatically gets put into a title match.

I didn't even go through half of Raw's problems and Smackdown has it's own problems as well, but till next time remember if you want to see Triple H face Kane in a match that Kane has no chance of winning the title in, and if you want to see several unfunny skits that don't help anyone do anything, and if you want to see a WWE-proclaimed boring wrestler, then tune in for next week's Raw!

[BreakABone]

I thought Bad Blood was average, not the worse PPV but far from the best.

Let me start off with this, I liked Austin as a wrestler, he has a cool character, but the fact is he doesn't wrestle anymore, we don't need 30 mins dedicated to his and Bischoff's feud. I mean I hate to say this, but Steph seems to have a better role as a GM, she is hardly around and just seems to be there to make the story flow even if it doesn't matter with Vince around now. Worse let, how many people care to see an 8- year old woman in a thong? I mean was the whole point to prove that Austin was wiser than Bischoff or something?

The card was lackluster overall. I mean I expected Flair/HBK to be a mat classic, it was a cool match with a very well done video package, but the match just seemed to miss something. The whole Randy Orton thing was kind of off as well, unless it pays off with some mini-fued between Orton and HBK, then a rematch with Flair/HBK at Summerslam.

The whole Booker T/ Chrisitian match was weird. I mean they force Chrisitian to get back in the ring to avoid a dQ loss, so they instead opted for a non-countout dQ, right away at that.

Jericho carried Goldberg to a pretty nice match. They rather overdid the spot where he ran into the barricade though. They showed it like 10 times during and after the match. I think the wisest thing to have done was make Jericho go over in some weird fashion, like Chrisitian run in or something like that, and continue the feud until SummerSlam that way Jericho has something to do. I mean what will they do with him now?

The street fight in the Hell in a Cell. I mean really what was the point of having the Cell if the only time it was realy used was when Nash was humping (that's what it looked like anyhow) Triple H in the corner, and when Triple H was grating his face on it. Other than that it was basically there. Foley's involvement was minimun, but I found it weird that he got a bigger pop than Nash and I think Triple H. My heart almost dropped out my heart when Nash hit Triple H with the slingshot into the barb wire and then the powerbomb, I thought Nash almost won, but good ole Triple H dind't let us down.

[Professor S]

Bad Blood was bad IMO, not average. I would not pay for it if I knew what I knew now. The only thing I really liked was the HIAC, but once again that was not what you would expect from a HIAC match. I do have to say that HHH is a good hardcore brawler, though. But hey, look who he learned from. Mick Foley walked him through their feud and how to introduce and sell barbed wire. Thats what a hardcore match should be. Not justb a mindless aray of trash can lid shots and literal "garbage" matches.

The WWE just doesn't seem to be going anywhere anymore. There doesn't look to be any real direction to the storylines or logic to the booking.

Perfect example: HHH. Now I'm not going to bury HHH here> I actually think he has been working really hard lately and has put on a nice string of matches (he also looks to have lost a little weight, which probably has something to do with it). What I am referring to is that there is no where to go with him anymore. He has been put over EVERYONE except for Goldberg, and with the way that Goldberg is being received a Goldberg title push might just kill the company. Who is going to carry the Raw flag into the future as a face champion? Heel champs don't work, expept with 2 notable exceptions (The Rock, but the draw was Austin being repeatedly screwed by Vince McMahon and still overcoming it, and Superstar Billy Gram, and thats just because no one had ever seen anything quite like him before).

Lets face it, even though I feel HHH has been doing a good job lately, he isn't drawing fans back to the product or creating new ones. But he has systematically annihilated almost every contender and sent them packing to the mid-card (Booker T the most recent additojn to the long list, who has gone from the Main Event to not even being able to win the InterContinental Championship).

Lets loom at the champs: HHH... heel. Christian... heel. La Resistance *cough*... sorry i vomited a little there... heel.

And the WWE wonders why they're not making any money...

[BreakABone]

Before I begin, Strangler was my trivia answer not correct or have you just forgotten about the whole thing?

Anyhow, I just noticed after Strangler mentioned it that all of Raw Champions are heel, and all of SmackDown champions are faces. An unique dynamic.


I think the WWE's problem is because of the lack of competition, they think they can get lazy. I mean they seem to be falling into all the traps that the late WCW did. They try to depend on older, more established Superstars who aren't much of a ratings draw, they continue to bury the talented younger guys in mid-card, they misuse many wrestlers and they resign establised stars as a way to get a quick pick me up.

As Strangler pointed out, the only time a heel champion works is when there is a strong face chasing them. Corpate Rock had Austin chasing gim even though they both had side feuds. Triple H had the Rock all throughout 2000, and they still had their seperate feuds. Yoko had Luger which didn't quite pay off, but it's the same thing.

Triple H has pretty much killed off all serious threats to his title other than maybe Goldberg, and the fans aren't quite reacting to him the way the WWE wanted. Of course, the WWE could always try and build up Kane as a monster, maybe have him defeat Triple H for the title next week on Raw. Then the following week set up a rematch where Triple H wins it back with the new member of Evolution. you then have Kane feud on and off with Evolution until about Survivor Series or so.

SmackDown seems to be in a bit better shape than Raw, but there are some stuff on SmackDown that needs to go. I don't need 30 mins a show dedicated to Vince, Hogan and Zach. I mean that whole feud would make sense if any of the three actually wrestled on a normal basis, but I think Mr. America has fought like twice, McMahon hasn't wrestled since Wrestlemania and well Zach has never wrestled. Another thing is the Big Show, who was ruined since day one. They tried to push him as a huge monster, it was set up nicely and he had a place to go. He could have feuded with Austin and the Rock throughout the summer of 99, but instead they turned him face like a month in, and his career hasn't quite recovered so they need to stop trying to push him. Also, they need to establish a clear set of faces and heel. At the moment, I think they should leave Angle and Lesnar as their two main faces with Taker and Mr. America coming into the scene every now and then. As their heels, they should have a Benoit led Team Angle, John Cena, Rhyno and Big Show and some others as fillers.

[TheGame]

I think that ever sense WM, HHH has improved... and that's all this fan needs to say on that subject. ;)

Raw and SD both have thier problems, but I still prefer Raw right now. Not to say either is "good" but I can handle Raw a little more. Jericho's Highlight/Hi-lite reel is better than Piper's pit imo... it's just a little more appealing to me.

I think the WWE should take advantage of that old rule where superstars can be traded. Like Stranger/BAB said, at the top of SD are powerful faces and terrible heels, and at the top of Raw is powerful heels and terrible faces. The Rock needs to come back to raw and take the belt from HHH, because it's either gonna be him or goldberg who HHH wil job to. After HHH loses.... even though I said it in the past and you allways disagreed... he should be traded to SD for Angle.

Why? This sets up two things... on Raw two neutral guys who can jump from good to bad will be on top... somthing that HHH should have been. Then on SD, on the top of the mountain, there is a dominant Face (one that the crowd acctually likes :eek: ) and a dominant Heel (one that I could imagine the crowd learning to hate).

But, meh, I hate tossing out ideas that will never happen anyway ;)

The shows are too far gone to fix imo, unless they merge the shows back together. There should be another "invasion" type PPV when the GMs fight to be the one and only GM of the WWE, and merge the shows back together. There are so many matches that would be classics that could happen now if it wasn't for the split.

[Professor S]

BAB, yes you were right, but I got bored and you would have won anyway. :)

Here's a good question: Who do you think should beat HHH to become the next face champ on Raw?

My vote? Chris Benoit. He should jump over to Raw immediately, as he is drowning in the mid-card on Smackdown. I know it will never happen as there seems to be a belief that Benoit could never get over because of his mic skills and the fact that he's not 7 feet tall and over 300 pounds (excuse me? Goldberg can't talk OR wrestle and they're pushing his useless ass). Plus I feel he could be the next "common-man" champ. The WWE could throw all the giants against him and have him chop them down. In this case his size could be his strength instead of his weakness as he is continually the underdog even though he holds the title. he will be the "little guy with temper and a big heart that overcomes the odds". People love to cheer for an underdog. add to this the fact that his finisher can be applied from nearly any situation and against any sized opponent and you have yourself some serious potential. He could be the next Bret Hart if they let him.

One can dream, can't they?:D

[TheGame]

See... Strangler you are thinking down the same path I am... it's like in the old days when a guy got transferd from WWF to WCW... or vice versa. Jeff Jarret for example, he was slowly dying off in the WWF, he goes to the WCW and it's like a fresh start... or even Jericho, in WCW he was also stuck in the Mid-card, the second he steps foot in the WWE he becomes a monster.

I think more Mid-card trades should happen... some people are burned out on SD (Undertaker or Big Show), and even more are burned out on Raw (HBK or Steiner). If they want a chance to give a guy a huge push, trades may be key. I mean, look at The Rock, he managed to make two "big" comebacks in a matter of weeks, once back to SD, and the blockbuster arrival on Raw.

I think Goldberg could be on the other side of the fence as his fans, and if he were traded to SD and maybe pushed as a heel it could at least make him more marketable. Top of the card trades shouldn't happen, well, at least not much. Right now would be a good time to trade some top card guys, because Brock has been feuding with the same people for what seems like forever... and Raw has more top card wrestlers but the guy at the top refuses to lose, so they need to go somewhere for a spotlight.

[BreakABone]

The WWE needs to draw a fine line between their heels and faces. I mean look at Bad Blood, Nash and Goldberg who are supposed to be like their top faces or atleast, who they push as their top faces, get booed or a very weak reaction. I mean before the match started, the fans started to turn on Goldberg and cheer on Jericho, and while Nash, when the special guest ref gets a bigger ovation than you, something is wrong.

What they should do, make Triple H, Golderg, Orton, Flair and Nash join into the Evolution stable. This way, all of them can look dominant without showing the weakness of their actual wrestling abilites. Then have Austin give motivation speeches like he gave to Kane and form a psuedo alliance against Evolution. He can get into the ear of Booker T, RVD, Lance Storm and several others. This way, they get the rub from Austin, they have a strong heel and face presence, and well the GM position actually means something.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by BreakABone
What they should do, make Triple H, Golderg, Orton, Flair and Nash join into the Evolution stable. This way, all of them can look dominant without showing the weakness of their actual wrestling abilites.

That sounds like what WCW did with the nWo ;)

It could work... but why get rid of HHH's only two threats? Unless HHH has had a big change of heart and decided to change his ways.

I think a good clique would be a nice idea, and not just any clique, one with some political power on the show (example: nWo had Bischoff at it's peak, the Corperation had, well, everybody). People wonder why the nWo flopped in the WWE... it's because they had no power and they couldn't go around intimidating the whole WWE.

[Professor S]

Guys, there was a question at the beginning of my last post...

Who would you put over HHH for the title? (I mean, he does have to lose it eventually)

[BreakABone]

Originally posted by The Strangler
Guys, there was a question at the beginning of my last post...

Who would you put over HHH for the title? (I mean, he does have to lose it eventually)
Actual, your last post had the fact that I got the trivia question right, and would have won the contest.:p

Anyhow, at this rate, I really don't know who should defeat Triple H and take the title, the simple fac tis, he has made so many oppenents seem weak and what have you, that it makes little sense to lose the belt to someone.

And I seriously hope they don't bring in someone else for him to feud with. The only person left is Sting anyhow.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by The Strangler
Who would you put over HHH for the title? (I mean, he does have to lose it eventually)

hmm... It would have to be someone who the WWE is ready to give the ultimate push to. Or someone well established as a fan favorite... I'm thinking somewhere along the lines of The Rock or Booker T.

I think Rock needs to come back and help the company, and making him champ and giving him a good 3-5 month title run would insure that he's back for a while, and give Raw a huge boost. Booker wouldn't have this great of an effect, but I could see him being pushed up to a level of Brock or Angle after a win like that.

[nWoCHRISnWo]

Originally posted by The Strangler
Guys, there was a question at the beginning of my last post...

Who would you put over HHH for the title? (I mean, he does have to lose it eventually)

Well I'm not so sure with the current storylines and roster split, they've screwed everything up too much IMO, but I would also like to see Benoit take the belt off Triple H. I also think a face Chris Jericho would be perfect for the job (he was perfect for this years ago, but didn't get the belt off Triple H). The crowd is clearly entertained by him on a nightly basis, he's very good at carrying weaker wrestlers to decent matches (Goldberg, Hogan, CHYNA) which Raw needs, he's over no matter what role he plays, he's seen as a big enough threat to be believable as a champ even after all that's happened to him in the last two years, he's gold on the mic, etc. He's like a perfect fit I'd say.

[NWO_STEVIE_NWO]

Maybe Animal from LOD deserves a shot at the title~!!