Sega!

[TheGame]

I hope the Topic name didn't throw you off:

"November 07, 2002 - Sega today announced a drastic revision in its earnings outlook for the current fiscal year, reducing its net profit estimate by 72%. The company now expects its profit for the year ending March 2003 to total 5 billion yen, rather than 18 billion as estimated this May. Sega stock dropped 300 yen, the maximum allowable daily decrease, to 1,212 yen, the lowest price it's seen in 22 months.
According to a report by Reuters, Sega is blaming lower-than-expected sales of NFL 2K3, as well as a few key delays in titles originally expected to make the holiday shopping season (such as Panzer Dragoon Orta). "We miscalculated financial targets for this year because of over-confidence stemming from results last year and a lack of experience as a third-party software publisher," said president Hideki Sato.

In a curious move, Sato admitted "total defeat" to Electronic Arts, whose Madden NFL 2003 considerably outsold NFL 2K3. Industry analysts observed that Sega's original projections for sales of NFL 2K3 were quite irrationally optimistic, drastically overestimating its potential success in its first year of direct competition with the strong Madden brand. Sega expected to move 1.6 million units of the game on PlayStation 2, a level it could only be expected to reach after years of steady promotion in opposition to Madden. In reality, it only sold around 300,000 units.

Sega cut its full-year global software sales goal from 20 million units to 12.6 million, 14% fewer units in comparison to last year. As a consequence, its consumer business will not turn a profit -- Sega expects an operating loss of 5.4 billion yen for the home game side of its business, where it had originally expected to make 8 billion yen.

CEO Tetsu Kayama attempted to reassure investors and analysts at a press conference. "Now we will tighten our grip to improve the quality of games and to save on development and sales costs," Kayama said. "Our goal to become the world's leading game software publisher remains unchanged." "

GOD I was waiting for them to get this wake-up call... they thought they would just step in and run things... 3 years bigger than EA? MWHAHAHAHAHA

I'm glad they are finally calming down and focusing on quality now... this year was insane, with all the DC ports and all the pointless releases.

Now that they know thay can't compete with EA, I expect a much better year from then next year.

[gekko]

All the DC ports? You must've seen more than I did.

Not surprising that Sega is in financial trouble. They really haven't had a huge new game come out. Hasn't exactly been their most exciting year. Though, I still loved it.

But I'm really struggling to find this "quality" that you say EA sports has. I must be missing something. I can't find much of anything buy crap.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by gekko
All the DC ports? You must've seen more than I did.

Yeah, you are right, besides NBA 2k2, Sonic Adventure 2, PSO, Shenume 2, and the soon to come Skies of Arcadia... there isn't many ;)

But I'm really struggling to find this "quality" that you say EA sports has. I must be missing something. I can't find much of anything buy crap.

lol

I'm honestly done argueing about quality... I show the IGN scores, EA wins. I show the sales charts, EA wins. What else can I do?

I give up, we can just talk about sales now, cause it's all opinion. Sega fans just disagree with the majority, and there's nothing I can do about it (or at least no more attempts by me to show you the light).

[GameKinG]

Well, a DC port has been Segas best selling game this gen.

[D-realJos]

Sega has potential, but it's clear that they are struggling to find points that they can capitalize on.

DC ports, Arcade ports, Sega Sports, Online Game, Franchise games, 16-bit Revivals, etc...

Nothing is taking great effect. The little that does take effect(SA, SMB, VF4) is held back by what doesn't.

Also, they are too damn concerned with EA, and the "need" to pump out games in large quantities, rather than do what they WERE known for. Making great games! I can't say I'm sorry for them, who da fuk told them to stoop to EA's level? You don't better a company by mimiking their exact moves(flooding the market with average to good games). Be yourself, deliver those games that the industry take note of.

If I were an investor, I wouldn't expect Sega's situation to change anytime soon. Reaons being; Sega probably realizes by now that they have to start truly ambitious and quility projects. By doing this, it'll take time. That would mean enduring a few quarters turning little to no profit. As a result, they are forced to release many games in between(being a top publisher and all). These games can only afford to be stuff they can quickly spit out. Meaning, expect a lot of ports, sport games based on slightly enhanced engines, and mediocre games. And guess what?

*You end up with the SAME problem all over again.*


Their success comes down to two things; management and sacrifice.

Management:
If Sega HAD(they do as of recently) a similar organization to Nintendo of Japan -- where a head group makes dessions on what projects to start, and monitors their progress and quality -- There's no way they would be in this mess now. Instead, they put quantity over quality, and allowed their development houses to handle project in a manner 3rd party would. Independently. Not good!

Sacrifice:
Take a hit and start with a fresh strategy. Sega started off on the wrong foot. (Excepting money from MS over sh!ty deal won't help their situation either). To get back on it's feet, they may have to take a hit due to a drought of games in effort to perpare truly great projects. Thus, a sacrifice! After that, forget about the QUANTITY race with EA, put quality over quantity and consentrate on better games like they did in the past. Only then, will things change.

[gekko]

Originally posted by TheGame
Yeah, you are right, besides NBA 2k2, Sonic Adventure 2, PSO, Shenume 2, and the soon to come Skies of Arcadia... there isn't many ;)

5 isn't many. And considering how much was added to PSO, it's still worth a buy for DC owners.

I'm honestly done argueing about quality... I show the IGN scores, EA wins. I show the sales charts, EA wins. What else can I do?

I give up, we can just talk about sales now, cause it's all opinion. Sega fans just disagree with the majority, and there's nothing I can do about it (or at least no more attempts by me to show you the light).

The only problem with you showing scores from IGN is that it doesn't mean ****. EA sells games in terms of quantity, not quality. 99% of EAs games are pure ****, and occasionally one or two slip through the cracks.

Here's what you're comparing:

EA Sports: ****ty games, but you got 50 new games to choose from each month

Sega: Great games that take a while to develop, and in the meantime, some ports from outstanding DC games on the side.

What was the last good game EA had? SSX? I rest my case.

[TheGame]

You just had to suck me in to this BS huh?

Originally posted by gekko
5 isn't many. And considering how much was added to PSO, it's still worth a buy for DC owners.

5 isn't many? DC DIED in early 2001... half a year before GCN and Xbox were even released! And they still have ports on the way.

They are just being cheap... I would have canned all 5 games to get Shenume 3, or a Sonic Adventure 3... being a DC owner, these ports are worthless.

The only problem with you showing scores from IGN is that it doesn't mean ****.

It doesn't? Then why did you post this?

http://www.gametavern.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3006

Funny huh? Seems what IGN says doesn't mean "****" unless sega wins... right? This is pathetic.

EA sells games in terms of quantity, not quality. 99% of EAs games are pure ****, and occasionally one or two slip through the cracks.

What does that make Sega?

IMO, Sega is no more than an EA wannabe. Once they turned third party, they turned crap.

I will be the first to admit, they have FARRRRRRRRRRRR more potiential than EA to make great games, but they aren't trying to do that. Like idiots they are trying to compete with EA. I cant't wait to see next year's sport games.. they don't have the resources like EA, so they will not be even close to an improvement over this year.... hell, NBA and NFL 2k3 weren't much of an improvement over last year.

Not to say EA just goes the extra mile with every game, but you would be hard pressed to find sombody who likes any 2002 games more than thier 2003 counterparts... Go to game faqs and look at the NBA 2k3 boards, or the NFL 2k3 boards, lots of people keep saying the 2k2 season was better.

And what's with Sega's new found buggyness? Ps2's NBA game screws completly up when you download a rosted update... and on GCN one out of every three games played it frezes up!

Sega needs to stop trying to compete with EA, and stop porting from DC, and start making some original games that are quality. Sega is a better developer than EA. But as long as they keep trying to be like EA they will stay ****ty.

Here's what you're comparing:

EA Sports: ****ty games, but you got 50 new games to choose from each month

that's your opinion... IMO EA releases one quality title per month. Ground breaking title? No. Quality? Yes. That's the model Sega is trying to follow, but they are so far behind it's sad.

Sega: Great games that take a while to develop, and in the meantime, some ports from outstanding DC games on the side.

ROFL

Sega? Taking Time you say? LMFAO

Yeah, I sure they took years to finish Sonic Adventure 2, Toe Jam and Earl, Shenume 3, Beach Spikers, Sega Soccoer Slam, Etc.

What was the last good game EA had? SSX? I rest my case.

Damn you are a EA hatin Sega fanboy

Maybe you should read this again:

http://www.gametavern.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3643

Oh, nm, You are just saying SSX is thier last great game based off of your opinion. Just like EA is crap in your opinion.

Lets take a poll, every game sell a vote.... now who is the best damn developer?

Sega wishes they could beat EA, but the sad truth is they can't, and they never will be able to. What now?

I'm not saying EA is the best, but because you are acting like it's a fact that they suck ass, it has to come down to this. Maybe you were one of that very exclusive group of 2,000 guys to buy NCAA 2k3 in the nation :D

Sega needs to do like Konami and Capcom and other little developers and know thier role... then they might acctually be able to make somthing quality.

[TheGame]

"Also, they are too damn concerned with EA, and the "need" to pump out games in large quantities, rather than do what they WERE known for. Making great games! I can't say I'm sorry for them, who da fuk told them to stoop to EA's level? You don't better a company by mimiking their exact moves(flooding the market with average to good games). Be yourself, deliver those games that the industry take note of."

I couldn't agree more

[gekko]

Originally posted by TheGame
You just had to suck me in to this BS huh?

:)

5 isn't many? DC DIED in early 2001... half a year before GCN and Xbox were even released! And they still have ports on the way.

They are just being cheap... I would have canned all 5 games to get Shenume 3, or a Sonic Adventure 3... being a DC owner, these ports are worthless.

They didn't make them for you. They made them for all the people who aren't DC owners. You know, there are a lot of them.

It doesn't? Then why did you post this?

http://www.gametavern.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3006

Funny huh? Seems what IGN says doesn't mean "****" unless sega wins... right? This is pathetic.

Comparing football to football, go ahead. Comparing basketball to basketball, go ahead. But you somehow think it's accurate comparing the average scores of a bunch of games which have nothing to do with each other.

What does that make Sega?

Ub3r l33t!

IMO, Sega is no more than an EA wannabe. Once they turned third party, they turned crap.

Long live Dreamcast!

NBA and NFL 2k3 weren't much of an improvement over last year.

It was the first year they got the game on all platforms. EA already had that step done. And how can you improve on perfection? ;)

Not to say EA just goes the extra mile with every game, but you would be hard pressed to find sombody who likes any 2002 games more than thier 2003 counterparts...

I liked Tiger Woods 2001 better than 2002. Does that count?

And what's with Sega's new found buggyness? Ps2's NBA game screws completly up when you download a rosted update... and on GCN one out of every three games played it frezes up!

Only played the Xbox version. So don't ask me.

that's your opinion... IMO EA releases one quality title per month.

I've yet to see one recently.

Lets take a poll, every game sell a vote.... now who is the best damn developer?

Windows sells a lot too. Most people think it sucks ass. Shall we apply that here?

Sega wishes they could beat EA, but the sad truth is they can't, and they never will be able to. What now?

Sega's better than EA. Sad truth is, EA can't make games for ****, except for a couple lucky ones here and there.

Maybe you were one of that very exclusive group of 2,000 guys to buy NCAA 2k3 in the nation :D

I hate college sport games.

[TheGame]

"Windows sells a lot too. Most people think it sucks ass. Shall we apply that here?"

Most people don't think it sucks ass... most harcore PC guys do, but I'm sitting in a room with over 500 people on Windows right now... I don't see them moaning about how crap it is ;)

But Like I said, Sega is a better developer than EA... just look at the top 3 games.

But are they being a better developer right now? Nope. As long as they are trying to be Like EA, they will never live up to thier full potiental.

If Sega were to calm down and Release a good 6 games per year, they would be one of the top developers... you know how good TJ&E would have been if they would have put more effort into it?

Sega isn't a 30 game per year developer like EA, and they need to stop tring to be. NHL, NBA, NFL, and World series should be thier only sport releases, and then they should work on what they are great at. There are games from Sega that come out that just give me one question, why?

Why release such a crappy NCAA game? Why release a BVB game that will be killed off by DOA beach volleyball? Why release TJ&E if you are just going to ruin the series?

[gekko]

NCAA games are crappy. Can't fix that.

Beach Spikers kicked ass. Looks at lot better than the bulding bitches.

And who said TJ&E ruined the series?

[TheGame]

Originally posted by gekko
NCAA games are crappy. Can't fix that.

NCAA 2003 for GCN Ps2 and Xbox all got better scores than Madden... they don't suck. It's just Sega's 6 .9 version sucks :p

Beach Spikers kicked ass. Looks at lot better than the bulding bitches.

Worst voleyball game I've ever played... and I likes some on Genesis and NES.

It's not set up very well, creating is crap, and getting your teamate to like you is like having a winning streak at paper rock sicsors. Training is gay too... they should have did more like the Tennis game... If you think this game kicks ass read some DOA:XBV previews, it will destroy Beach Spikers.

[Jason1]

I would get into this little arguement, but I wont because I dont have much to say. All I know is ive always liked Sega's games better, and I cant remember a time where I have REALLY had fun with an EA game, While I have so many great memories with Sega games. Its as simple as that. Some EA games are fun in short bursts, but dont give me too much of it...

[bobcat]

From a soccer fan (me) I used to like Fifa, until I played ISS pro Evolution. Waaaaaaaaaaay better ;)

Not a big fan of EA. Not much of a Sega fan. Used to be, until the SNES came out :p

Don't knock the DC however. That was one of my favourite systems. And still is. I don't play it much nemore, but it had some excellent games.

[Perfect Stu]

As it stands, EA Sports and Sega Sports are fairly even IMO...I might give the edge to EA Sports, because:

a) I haven't played NHL2K3 yet (although I'm sure it will be better than NHL 2003)
b) Sega doesn't have a golf game...and I enjoy the Tiger Woods series
c) EA's NCAA Football game is amazing. Too bad they don't sell it here in Canada.

Sega does, however, make a good tennis game...

In other genres, I haven't found many Sega games I enjoy since probably the Sonic series on Genesis...but I do like Medal of Honor: Allied Assault for PC (EA Games) and SimGolf for PC (EA Games)...and I'm betting 007: Nightfire will be a very good game for XBox...

Just some of my opinions...No point in arguing with those two stubborn bastards ;)

[bobcat]

Oh yeh and I think Camelot have made the best/most realistic tennis game out there (gameplay wise). Mario Tennis!

I think Virtua Tennis is BS. The way the ball is hit in the position that it lands is unrealistic (e.g. If the ball bounces really low in front of the net, you can perform a clean for/back hand). In real tennis (and in Mario tennis), the angle from which the ball is landed would result in you either:-

1) Lobbing the ball
2) Touching the ball over the net very slightly
3) Going crosscourt , againt touching the ball over the net
4) Smashing your racquet on the floor (dunno about this with Mario tennis).