Nintendo lowers Shipping estimates; Mario sales expectations not met

[Perfect Stu]

Source (http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1031119802873)

Nintendo lowers shipping and profit forecast

By Michiyo Nakamoto in Tokyo
Published: October 1 2002 12:05 | Last Updated: October 1 2002 12:05

Nintendo confirmed growing worries about its performance with the announcement on Tuesday that shipments of its games consoles this year would be lower than initially forecast.

The group said shipments of GameCube, would be 10m rather than 12m and those of Game Boy Advance would be 15m rather than 19m, due to weaker than expected demand amid the Japanese economic slump.

Nintendo also lowered its full-year recurring profit forecast from Y150bn ($1.23bn) to Y110bn and net profit from Y90bn to Y80bn.

Nintendo said, however that shipments of GameCube software would be 55m units rather than the forecast 36m because third party games had been selling better than expected.

In the first half, Nintendo expects a sharp drop in recurring profits, or 77 per cent below its initial forecast, due to the yen's rise against the US dollar.

Nintendo said that its first half group recurring profit would be Y7bn rather than an initially forecast Y30bn due to a large appraisal loss on foreign currency based assets.

However, Nintendo still expects to achieve its forecast group net profit of Y18bn in the first half, thanks to a one-off gain from its sale of Rare, the game developer. Nintendo has sold its 49 per cent stake in the games developer to Microsoft.

Satoru Iwata, president, said the group aims to raise its share of the US market from 20 per cent, to over 30 per cent after the Christmas shopping season but had no intention of reducing the price of GameCube, its latest console.

Nintendo has had a difficult time with its new consoles, which have not had the big push from popular titles that is crucial for hardware sales.

In particular, Super Mario Sunshine, the latest game developed by games legend Shigeru Miyamoto, has not lived up to the initial high expectations that had built up around it. This is one of GameCube's most important titles and was launched in August, but it has not seen the huge following Mr Miyamoto's titles have enjoyed in the past.

"We are concerned that [technical and design problems] may keep the game from becoming the perpetually best-selling, 10-million unit classic that Super Mario 64 was," said Noriko Manabe, games analyst at JP Morgan in Tokyo.

Ms Manabe is also concerned that Super Mario Sunshine did not seem to be "moving that much hardware".

The concerns about Nintendo's software line-up were aggravated by its decision to sell its 49 per cent stake in Rare, which had provided many of Nintendo's hit games in the past. Although Rare has not delivered as significantly recently, the sale, "almost guarantees that XBox is going to be number 2 in Europe," said Ms Manabe.

[TheGame]

Wow... they must be some Strong Rare followers in Europe :D

[BlueFire]

Ouch. :unsure:

[Mushlafa]

yeah... ouch... whatever.... they got metroid and zelda commin out soon right? Those should sell a lot of consoles...

[DeathsHand]

Originally posted by Mushlafa
yeah... ouch... whatever.... they got metroid and zelda commin out soon right? Those should sell a lot of consoles...

Isn't that what people said about Resident Evil? And then Mario? :p

[Mushlafa]

yeah but resident evil isnt as big as like zelda and metroid ... IMO :p

[Bond]

Originally posted by DeathsHand
Isn't that what people said about Resident Evil? And then Mario? :p
That's what always happens Deathshand. :)

[DeathsHand]

Originally posted by Mushlafa
yeah but resident evil isnt as big as like zelda and metroid ... IMO :p

True, but people said it... now what about Mario? ;)

People before NGC was released: "NGC will be awesome! I will take Nintendo back to the glory days of SNES!"

*NGC is released and slows down a bit*

People: "Well, Resident Evil should help jumpstart the sales!"

*Resident Evil is released*

People: "... hmm... Well, Mario should help jumpstart the sales!"

*Mario is released*

People: "... Zelda and Metroid are coming out soon, they will sell a lot of systems!"

;)

I'm not saying Mush necesarily said all that, I just find it funny, piecing together things I've heard from before NGC was released to the present... :sneaky:

[TheGame]

No way Metriod out-sells Mario... unless it's one of those rare 9.8-10.0 games. Zelda may pick up sales, but then again, it could do like Mario because Nintendo made major changes to the game.

[Crono]

Hmm, it's pretty much what I had expected, there arent many "killer" titles in Japan ...there's SMS, it was selling great for a while, but I guess it has slowed down now.
And I can see why RE didnt sell that well, I mean, its pretty good and the RE series is pretty big in Japan, but something tells me that RE's exclusiveness to GCN was the reason for the "bad" sales.


Still, it's too early to judge GCN's fate, it hasn't even been out for a year (well it has in Japan but meh.) It still has a good 5 years left so we shall see how the future unfolds.

[DarkMaster]

i have enjoyed SSB:M, SMS, ED, and RE on GCN so far, and thats all that matters to me. Metroid Prime looks awesome, PSO looks like great fun, Eternal Arcadia Legend so far sounds amazing, and i cant wait for Zelda. so right now, i have little to no problems with GCN. keep em coming

[TheGame]

Originally posted by Crono
Still, it's too early to judge GCN's fate, it hasn't even been out for a year (well it has in Japan but meh.) It still has a good 5 years left so we shall see how the future unfolds.

That's Sony's decision... just Hope Soy waits on Ps3... or GCN only got a good 2-3 years left before it gets real competition.

[DarkMaster]

Originally posted by TheGame
That's Sony's decision... just Hope Soy waits on Ps3... or GCN only got a good 2-3 years left before it gets real competition.
i agree with you in theory

[fingersman]

What did Nintendo expect?? For SMS to rip sales charts and hit 20 million?? Please?? I'm sure sunshine is great.....but what about all that hype it had about innovative it would be.

Hey let's put a water pack on Mario's back and stuff.....Phsff ...really inovative Nintendo....All SMS is, is an upgrade to SM64.....so I hope they didn't expect it to sell at the same rate or same amount.

Besides all of this is basically Nintendo's falut anyways...if they'd stop being so damn secretive and tell people what the hell they are making......and what's going on with their 1st and 2nd parties maybe they wouldn't have this problem.
But then again maybe they might who knows.

All I know is that Nintendo better get something inovative and great really fast or they might end up no.3 in this console war.
( or maybe they should just put Shiggy back to mainly making games instead of him managing other people's stuff)

[BlueFire]

Originally posted by TheGame
That's Sony's decision... just Hope Soy waits on Ps3... or GCN only got a good 2-3 years left before it gets real competition. Uh, I think Nintendo will still keep GC out for a normal five year period. The Ps2 was out for over a year before its competition came.

[Mushlafa]

and thats why xbox and GC are so far behind ps2....

[Joeiss]

Originally posted by Mushlafa
and thats why xbox and GC are so far behind ps2....


Wow. You are one smart puppy! Do you want a cookie?



:rolleyes:



Anyways...... I am surprised by this.... I seriously thought that SMS would be a huge system seller.... Damn Nintendo... They should have released a Mario title at their launch!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mushlafa]

and have it suck? and yeah i would like a cookie
*grabs cookie from joeiss*
yummm :P

[Jason1]

In my mind, the main thing slowing down Sunshine is marketing. They need to make me head of Marketing. I would show em how its done. But seirously folks, I dont think you can get much worse that the famous clean is better than dirty commercial. And when I first heard RE would be exclusive, I was sure it would drastically help nintendo, but now im not so sure, I think some fans have just forgotten about it, or let it go peacefully. Besides, there are so many other games for PS2, I dont think they need it. And while im now fine with Celda, I think from a marketing and consumer standpoint, that turned off pretty much every casual Zelda fan. Sure people here will still buy, but relying on hard-core fans isnt good enough. Many casual fans will be turned off by this, greatly effecting sales, you can bet on that.

[CrOnO_LiNk]

If only Nintendo had Square... 2 million a week in Japan. That's amazing!

[TheGame]

Originally posted by BLueFire
Uh, I think Nintendo will still keep GC out for a normal five year period. The Ps2 was out for over a year before its competition came.

That's why I said 2-3 years... Ps3 is supposed to be out in 2004.. that gives GCN 2 years if Nintendo5 comes out the same year, or 3 years if it comes out a year later. If it comes out two years later... well, I don't see Nintendo doing too well.

[Mushlafa]

actually ps3 is sappose to be out 2005... i was jus readin a bunch of stupid 10 year old fanboys talkin bout it.... i know technology advances fast but they were giving speeds like 100-500 ghz for the CPU and SD ram at speeds in the 10's of ghz...
The one thing they mighta had right was the release date :unsure:

[Blix]

Originally posted by Jason1
Sure people here will still buy, but relying on hard-core fans isnt good enough. Many casual fans will be turned off by this, greatly effecting sales, you can bet on that.

So true. and to think causla gamers were once a minority in video games.

[Angrist]

Please remember that RE was just a REMAKE. Why would the fans buy a GCN for a game they've already played? If any RE game can sell Cubes, it will be RE0.

And I don't think the cellshading will keep ppl from buying Zelda. They will see the ads, they'll see how cool it is and how nice the graphics are. Sellda will zel.

[Perfect Stu]

Originally posted by Mushlafa
and thats why xbox and GC are so far behind ps2....

yes...and no

it was the reason why the PS2 led by X many systems, but since the Gamecube and XBox have been released, it has still DESTROYED them in sales. The head start doesn't explain why PS2 is still dominating weekly sales charts.

[Professor S]

I starting to think that Mario, Zelda and the rest of the high anticipated Nintendo franchises have already moved many of the consoles that they were expected, but they did so AT LAUNCH. Remember the delays and that most fans of Nintendo franchises, are Nintendo fans to begin with, so you would think that they would have bought a console ASAP. Just an idea.

[PuPPeT]

Originally posted by Perfect Stu
yes...and no

it was the reason why the PS2 led by X many systems, but since the Gamecube and XBox have been released, it has still DESTROYED them in sales. The head start doesn't explain why PS2 is still dominating weekly sales charts.



But console almost always sale better on there second year of sales and then you will see sales drop off. But yes it is funny to hear about how Microsoft is going to monopolizes the games market and turn it’s back on the hardcore game especially when Sony are on the edge of doing the same thing Sony can do just about any thing they want this generation knowing to well there going to sale more units then any one else with ease. Where as Nintendo and Microsoft has to build up and rely on the Hardcore gamer as the masses are about as brain washed as it gets with Sony Consoles and will follow it blindly to where every Sony wants them it’s trendy to have a Sony it’s Kiddy to have a Nintendo and well it monopolizes to have an Microsoft. Come on it you know nothing about the games scene what Console are you going to buy? The kiddy one, the monopolizing one or the trendy one your mate has which ok has less power crap graphics and sound but its kool


But look at this way Sony after the last generation is about the only company who are going to lose market share this time around! Microsoft can only gain share in the market as it has nothing to lose and Nintendo look like they are going to a lest get a 20% share like they had before if not a bit more around 25 to 30% by 2005 and I would say about the same for Microsoft (Who knows maybe more maybe less). Hell some one better stop Sony or it really will be a monopoly come the next generation and that’s bad for every one.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by PuPPeT
But console almost always sale better on there second year of sales and then you will see sales drop off.

That's not always true... Ps2 has dominated GCN/Xbox in 2001 and 2002... unless they sell a good 5 million consoles each in this Holiday season strecth (assuming Sony gets no sales :rolleyes: ) they will not grab Sony's 3rd year sales with thier second year sales.

But yes it is funny to hear about how Microsoft is going to monopolizes the games market and turn it’s back on the hardcore game especially when Sony are on the edge of doing the same thing Sony can do just about any thing they want this generation knowing to well there going to sale more units then any one else with ease. Where as Nintendo and Microsoft has to build up and rely on the Hardcore gamer as the masses are about as brain washed as it gets with Sony Consoles and will follow it blindly to where every Sony wants them it’s trendy to have a Sony it’s Kiddy to have a Nintendo and well it monopolizes to have an Microsoft. Come on it you know nothing about the games scene what Console are you going to buy? The kiddy one, the monopolizing one or the trendy one your mate has which ok has less power crap graphics and sound but its kool

I, being a hardcore gamer, could care less about graphics. In my opinion, Sony's console sales compared to GCN's and Xbox's is exactly like Sony's game quality compared to GCN's and Xbox's.

I'm neither brain washed, or playing it because everybody else thinks it's cool. In my opinion, if we were to list the top 20 games for this generation, at least 15 would go to Sony. That's why it's selling better.

Have you learned anything from the Psx Era? Or from seeing Game Gear get killed by the all mighty powerful Gameboy? Game quality wins out. If Ps2 was honestly truly crap, it would have flopped. If N64 can do it, Ps2 can do it.

But look at this way Sony after the last generation is about the only company who are going to lose market share this time around! Microsoft can only gain share in the market as it has nothing to lose and Nintendo look like they are going to a lest get a 20% share like they had before if not a bit more around 25 to 30% by 2005 and I would say about the same for Microsoft (Who knows maybe more maybe less). Hell some one better stop Sony or it really will be a monopoly come the next generation and that’s bad for every one.

I wouldn't mind it being a Sony Monopoly... because they have the system with the best games. Now, if Nintendo 64 would have dominated Psx in sales, then we'd have a monopoly problem. Nintendo couldn't handle winning two generations (SNES/Nes), what makes you think they could handle 3? We'd still be using carts today if Nintendo would have won... and gaming in general would have turned extremely crappy.

At least Sony is releasing a decent product... and at least they are concentrating on games. Not to say Nintendo and M$ aren't... they just have been making more hardware innovations this generation than game innovations.

[Professor S]

Saying the PS2 has the best games is much like saying that if you put a million monkeys in a room with a million typewriters for a million years, they would write Shakespeare. Does the PS2 have a lot of good-great games? Sure, but they have about 20 times that much absolute CRAP.

Right now I think the Gamecube and XBox have a better good game to bad game ration than PS2.

When was the last great PS2 game released? A long time ago, and i don't see all that much besides Vice City on the horizon.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by The Strangler
Does the PS2 have a lot of good-great games? Sure, but they have about 20 times that much absolute CRAP.

Right now I think the Gamecube and XBox have a better good game to bad game ration than PS2.

Does the ratio really matter?

If one system has 500 games, and 20% of the games are good, and a system has 100 games and 90% of them are good, does that really make the 90% system better?

Count the games over 9.0 at IGN, Gamespot, or in any of your mags, and Ps2 has everybody else murderd. That's all that matters. If you don't like the crap, you don't have to buy it, but thers is a lot more good content there to chose from.

When was the last great PS2 game released? A long time ago, and i don't see all that much besides Vice City on the horizon.

When was the last great Xbox game released? (Launch?)

When was there ever that great of a game for GCN? (SSBM? ED?)

When has anybody released a racing game that's better than GT3.. or a game period that's better than GTA3? Does Nintendo or MS have an RPG that can beat out KH or FFX? Who gets all the sports games first? Anybody got a fighter that destroys the Duo of Tekken 4 and Virtual Fighter 4?

I'm not saying Xbox and GCN are crap... Ps2 just got them beat in game quality IMO.

I think Xbox is in second, and GCN is in third... for the present and the furtue... but it's all "IMO"

[Professor S]

GCN = SMS, Starfox, RE were all released after launch

XBox = Morrowind (which can't even be played on the PS2), Rallisport Challenge, Sega GT, Blinx (about to be released) were all released after launch.

Its pretty much common knowledge that the XBox has the best selection of racing games on the market today spanning all genre's from arcade to sim to "other" (PGR)

Saying that the number of games out means nothing when comparing the number of quality games is just silly. The PS2 has had over a one year head start over both the XBox and GCN. And they also have been spitting out games for just as long. Throw enough darts a board while blindfolded and you'll still hit the bulleye more times if you have more darts.

IMO the PS2 has peaked, and if you look at the games coming up, you can see that. Its full of sequels and other just plain average looking titles.

If you look at the GCN and XBox and their upcoming releases, you can see that they are just getting warmed up, especially the XBox.

[BlueFire]

Nintendo really needs to reach out to all gamers.

Don't make commercials like that Sunshine commercial. I don't know if it was intended to make it look funny, but it looked stupid.
Metroid Prime commercial sounds very interesting. They'll probably be able to reach a good chunk of the gaming population with that. A casual gamer would be like: " SWEET ! IT LOOKS SO REAL AND AWESOME AND THIS AND THAT AND stfu ;)" So... I can only hope they'll go far with that.

Same with RE0. Make it a good commercial.

[PuPPeT]

Originally posted by TheGame
When has anybody released a racing game that's better than GT3.. or a game period that's better than GTA3?

Well that’s a very Fanboy thing to say In fact I don't like GT3 doing up the cars was fine and all (Ok the same as the last two games) But when the game gets on the track it all falls apart the game plays like a dog It does not play like an arcade race and there’s no way in hell it plays like a SIM the whole racing experience of the game was just boring in fact the only thing that keeps people play is modding of the cars. And as for GTA3 get the **** out of it’s hype the game was in no way terrible or any thing like that but the best game every get a life, it was good but not that good.

And you go on about PS2 has so many more games then any thing else well yea it’s been out for a whole year longer if you care to look back a little you will see a console a year ago which had almost nothing on it after a whole year of being on sale (how short are PS2 fans memories I recall all the Bitching they were doing). Face it after two years of being on the market PS2 has got almost nothing to show for it a hand full of AAA which it should have had in the first year.

[Jason1]

Originally posted by The Strangler
GCN = SMS, Starfox, RE were all released after launch

XBox = Morrowind (which can't even be played on the PS2), Rallisport Challenge, Sega GT, Blinx (about to be released) were all released after launch.

Its pretty much common knowledge that the XBox has the best selection of racing games on the market today spanning all genre's from arcade to sim to "other" (PGR)

Saying that the number of games out means nothing when comparing the number of quality games is just silly. The PS2 has had over a one year head start over both the XBox and GCN. And they also have been spitting out games for just as long. Throw enough darts a board while blindfolded and you'll still hit the bulleye more times if you have more darts.

IMO the PS2 has peaked, and if you look at the games coming up, you can see that. Its full of sequels and other just plain average looking titles.

If you look at the GCN and XBox and their upcoming releases, you can see that they are just getting warmed up, especially the XBox.

You make some good points, but you have to realise that casual gamers dont give a poop what games are coming up, they will keep buying the same sequls for the same system they own, wether the game gets a 10 or a 1. If GTA Vice City got a bad review, which I know it wont, it would still sell, because most people dont look at stuff like that. Just some thoughts.

[DarkMaster]

Originally posted by PuPPeT
Well that’s a very Fanboy thing to say In fact I don't like GT3 doing up the cars was fine and all (Ok the same as the last two games) But when the game gets on the track it all falls apart the game plays like a dog It does not play like an arcade race and there’s no way in hell it plays like a SIM the whole racing experience of the game was just boring in fact the only thing that keeps people play is modding of the cars. And as for GTA3 get the **** out of it’s hype the game was in no way terrible or any thing like that but the best game every get a life, it was good but not that good.

And you go on about PS2 has so many more games then any thing else well yea it’s been out for a whole year longer if you care to look back a little you will see a console a year ago which had almost nothing on it after a whole year of being on sale (how short are PS2 fans memories I recall all the Bitching they were doing). Face it after two years of being on the market PS2 has got almost nothing to show for it a hand full of AAA which it should have had in the first year.
well thats a very fanboy thing to say. PS2's games have both quality and quantity. I have enjoyed far more games on ps2 than GCN and Xbox combined. I love my GCN, but right now PS2 is on my #1. how can you say PS2 doesnt have a good amount of AAA games? right off the top of my head i can think of plenty. FFX, GTA3, SH2, MGS2, Dark Cloud, Devil May Cry, ZOE, and sh*t loads more. face it, your a nintendo fanboy

[Professor S]

I think what we (or maybe just me) are trying to say is that poeple are saying that the PS2's game library is being directly compared to the individual libraries of the XBox and GCN and thats an unfair comparison. The PS2 has been out much longer. So, DUH, it SHOULD have more good games.

But I think you should also agree that if you compared the PS2's selection at the same point as the XBox and GCN are at now after launch, that the PS2 would be sorely in need of some great games.

Both XBox and GCN are far ahead of where PS2 was at this point after launch.

BTW, I thought SH2 sucked.;)

[DeathsHand]

Originally posted by The Strangler
BTW, I thought SH2 sucked.

*points gun at Strangler*

Say that again, I dare ya... c'mon... try me... :mad:

:D

uhh yeah uhh... PS2 is uhh... r0x0rz.... but so is NGC and XBox? :unsure:

[Perfect Stu]

oh no...

I'm starting to see blatant fanboyism in PuPPeT again

Please explain to me why PS2 is 'cool'?

When will people except that most people prefer the Playstation 2's game library over XBox's and Gamecube's?

[Shadow_Link]

You know what guys... Everyone's right here. As you see, when it comes to games, everyone has different tastes (I've said that a million times). Why would Puppet be a fanboy if he said that the PS2 library of games in the first year couldn't match either the Gc's or PS2's? Though it is near fact, it is also his opinion. So what if he didn't like GT3 or SH2? Why would TheGame be a fanboy for saying that GT3 is the best racer ever?

And why would Strangler be a fanboy? The real fanboy's are the people who defend their system by calling others fanboys, and stuffing a list of games down their throats.

Heh, I guess someones going to call me a fanboy for no apparent reason... :unsure:

Looking at several posts, I guess everyone is a fanboy... If you want to see real fanboys, head on over to IGN.

[DarkMaster]

Originally posted by Shadow_Link
If you want to see real fanboys, head on over to IGN.
you are so right its not even funny

[bobcat]

Originally posted by DarkMaster
you are so right its not even funny
Not funny hey :hmm:

:lol:

:(

[Perfect Stu]

I didn't call anyone a fanboy

I said I detected fanboyism in PuPPeT for his 'the only reason why PS2 is selling the best is because people are brainwashed and they have to buy PS2 because it's "cool"'

that's ridiculous and everyone knows it...except for those with a pinch of fanboyism in them ;)

Originally posted by Shadow_Link
Heh, I guess someones going to call me a fanboy for no apparent reason... :unsure:

Shutup fanboy! :mad:

[TheGame]

Originally posted by The Strangler
I think what we (or maybe just me) are trying to say is that poeple are saying that the PS2's game library is being directly compared to the individual libraries of the XBox and GCN and thats an unfair comparison. The PS2 has been out much longer. So, DUH, it SHOULD have more good games.

But I think you should also agree that if you compared the PS2's selection at the same point as the XBox and GCN are at now after launch, that the PS2 would be sorely in need of some great games.

Both XBox and GCN are far ahead of where PS2 was at this point after launch.

BTW, I thought SH2 sucked.;)

Some things in life just aren't fair. When I was at Nintendose and Ps2 wasn't even out for 3 months people said DC had a better library of games. Nintendo and Sega fans alike were bitching because Ps2's launch line-up didn't kill off 1 year (2 if you count Japan) of DC games.

In the casual gamer's eye, he walks to the store with $300... and all three systems just launched the day he got the money to buy one.

In my eyes, they are all the same too. Why? Maybe because Nintendo and MS could have had thier systems out in 2000... but they decided to wait and increase the quality. Thier decision to wait directly effected thier sales and the amount of games on thier console. Ps2 was kicking thier asses at launch, and Ps2 has no signs of slowing down.

If you look at the GCN and XBox and their upcoming releases, you can see that they are just getting warmed up, especially the XBox.

I think Xbox and Ps2 are just warming up... considering they will have the first console online wars. GCN just doesn't look that special in the future to me.

But the conversation is about what is happening now, and why casual gamers uy Ps2 over the competition. I doubt any casual gamer would say "GCN has only been out for a year, so I should skip on games like FFX, MGS2, and GTA3/VC and but one"

No, they see it simple... it's GTA3, FFX, and MGS2 vs Mario, ED, and SSB:M... based on popularity, and quality, that's the reason Ps2 sells more. Compared to Xbox, it's the same way, the curve of quality gets closer, while the popularity seperates the games.

Call me a Ps2 fanboy all you guys want... but if GCN, Xbox, and Ps2 stopped having games developed for the rest of time, and I was forced to get one system and it's whole current line up, Ps2 wins, hands down.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by PuPPeT
And you go on about PS2 has so many more games then any thing else well yea it’s been out for a whole year longer if you care to look back a little you will see a console a year ago which had almost nothing on it after a whole year of being on sale (how short are PS2 fans memories I recall all the Bitching they were doing). Face it after two years of being on the market PS2 has got almost nothing to show for it a hand full of AAA which it should have had in the first year.

A fanboy is calling me a fanboy... ok :confused:

As of October 2001, Ps2 didn't have a competitive line up with Xbox and GCN?

Lets even look in the future.

December 25th 2001 for Ps2 vs December 25th 2002 for GCN/Xbox... who has the best line up?

I'm not going to say Ps2 has the best (even though it could be argued) but I will say it is more than competitive. My Personal #1 pick would be Ps2, then Xbox, and GCN far behind in third.

[Perfect Stu]

Originally Posted by PuPPeT
Face it after two years of being on the market PS2 has got almost nothing to show for it a hand full of AAA which it should have had in the first year

you don't own a PS2 do you?

[PuPPeT]

Originally posted by Perfect Stu
I didn't call anyone a fanboy

I said I detected fanboyism in PuPPeT for his 'the only reason why PS2 is selling the best is because people are brainwashed and they have to buy PS2 because it's "cool"'

All I'm saying PS2 has such a cool image and people are buying the console for that reason I don't know what it's like in north America but over here you will be hard pressed to find a trendy night club with out a PS2 in it and that not unintentionally done Sony went after the kool image from the start over here and it has worked. I know people who have done this they have gone out and got a PS2 with 4 or 5 games and just left it under the TV and when I ask them why they got it they all say cuss it’s kool. Not one of them went well I wanted this game or this thing it was just kool. Now I’m not saying every PS2 owner is that brain washed I’m just saying over here at lest 60 to 70% of them are.

Also I stand by what I said and I think The Game is acting a bit stupid on this! No one should have monopoly on the Games market and if we let Sony do just that we will be the ones who will have to live with it Higher cost games and consoles does not sound very good to me plus Sony would have complete control over the market pushing small game developers out of the way. I can just see Nintendo getting around about 20% of the market share this generation and going **** this and not making another home console (Which would be a very sad day indeed). IF Sony runs away with this the Games market as we all know and love it over.

And Yes I have checked up on what I have said and yes Console almost always sale there best in the second year on the shop floor In fact out of the top 10 best selling games Consoles of all time only one has not sold better in it second year and that was the N64. So yes I would say know that sales of the PS2 which have been VERY high will start to dip down next year by how much I do not know.

Oh and yes I do act like a Fanboy over here cuss no one else can be assed to play on the Xbox's side so i do it. I do in real life have a PS2, PC and a Xbox and i play all of them when ever i can but i don't have alot of time for that any more you see i just got my Xbox chipped so i'm coding some kool DX8 stuff for it.

[Xantar]

About the original topic:

People keep kvetching about how poorly Nintendo's games have done and so on, but stop a minute and really read that report.

The major reason Nintendo is lowering profit expectations and console sales expectations is because of the relatively strong performance of the Japanese yen. This is completely out of Nintendo's control.

As to Mario sales, we don't know how well it has done. But GameCube sales reportedly doubled when the game launched, so some people out there were waiting for it. Besides that, Nintendo raised expectations for software sales by 20 million because of strong third party support.

So maybe Nintendo overestimated Mario's performance. But by how much? We don't know. But I know this: Nintendo isn't perfect. When making predictions, they are allowed to make mistakes.

[TheGame]

Originally posted by Xantar
About the original topic:

People keep kvetching about how poorly Nintendo's games have done and so on, but stop a minute and really read that report.

The major reason Nintendo is lowering profit expectations and console sales expectations is because of the relatively strong performance of the Japanese yen. This is completely out of Nintendo's control.

As to Mario sales, we don't know how well it has done. But GameCube sales reportedly doubled when the game launched, so some people out there were waiting for it. Besides that, Nintendo raised expectations for software sales by 20 million because of strong third party support.

It's happening again :wtf:

So maybe Nintendo overestimated Mario's performance. But by how much? We don't know. But I know this: Nintendo isn't perfect. When making predictions, they are allowed to make mistakes.

I think Mario 64's success shouldn't have been brought into the equasion to begin with... and I think that's what Nintendo did. I mean, they are two different games any two different times... Mario 64 is on both the top 5 list for Revolutionary and Evelutionary games in history. Somthing the Sunshine could never have done.

I wonder how much they were estimating too... :hmm: (remember, we are talking about the same guys who thought Conker would be a million seller)

[TheGame]

Originally posted by PuPPeT
All I'm saying PS2 has such a cool image and people are buying the console for that reason I don't know what it's like in north America but over here you will be hard pressed to find a trendy night club with out a PS2 in it and that not unintentionally done Sony went after the kool image from the start over here and it has worked. I know people who have done this they have gone out and got a PS2 with 4 or 5 games and just left it under the TV and when I ask them why they got it they all say cuss it’s kool. Not one of them went well I wanted this game or this thing it was just kool. Now I’m not saying every PS2 owner is that brain washed I’m just saying over here at lest 60 to 70% of them are.

Night club with a Ps2? :wtf:

Also I stand by what I said and I think The Game is acting a bit stupid on this! No one should have monopoly on the Games market and if we let Sony do just that we will be the ones who will have to live with it Higher cost games and consoles does not sound very good to me plus Sony would have complete control over the market pushing small game developers out of the way.

(learn how to use a period)

I'm not saying anybody should have a monopoly on the games market I like it fine just the way it is. I'm saying that if there were a Monopoly, I wouldn't want Nintendo or Microsoft having the "only" system. We already know hoe MS is...

Then look at Nintendo, building off of the sucsess of NES and SNES, they built the masterpiece called N64. :unsure:

Building off the sucsess of Gameboy they made Gameboy pocket... then Gameboy color... then Gameboy advanced! Makes me wonder why handheld games are advancing so slow.

As a fan of sports games there is no way in hell I would want Nintendo and thier small memory space habbits ruling the console world... I would rather have micrsoft!!!

Not to say that I would want a monopoly, I just wouldn't want Nintendo with the grip on the industry.

I can just see Nintendo getting around about 20% of the market share this generation and going **** this and not making another home console (Which would be a very sad day indeed). IF Sony runs away with this the Games market as we all know and love it over.

Dreamcast died didn't it? Genesis died, didn't it? But did Sega die? NO

If GCN died I wouldn't give a rat's ass... especially after seeing my favorite sports games like Madden, NBA Live, and NBA 2k2 suffering major cutbacks. Then seeing all the Rare games and THQ/Aki wrestling games gone... GCN has no use now. I would be glad if Nintendo became a 3rd party developer. It's not like they are doing anything so great with GCN that it can't possibly be done as a third party.

Before GCN launched, I expected it to be the best system in the batch, and it ends up being the worst (for me).

And Yes I have checked up on what I have said and yes Console almost always sale there best in the second year on the shop floor In fact out of the top 10 best selling games Consoles of all time only one has not sold better in it second year and that was the N64. So yes I would say know that sales of the PS2 which have been VERY high will start to dip down next year by how much I do not know.

I think console sales will do all the diping, but the game sales will remain strong until hype of a new upcoming system arises.

Oh and yes I do act like a Fanboy over here cuss no one else can be assed to play on the Xbox's side so i do it. I do in real life have a PS2, PC and a Xbox and i play all of them when ever i can but i don't have alot of time for that any more you see i just got my Xbox chipped so i'm coding some kool DX8 stuff for it.

You must have bought that Ps2 for it's "cool" factor huh? If GCN is cheaper and better, why not buy one?

[Shadow_Link]

TheGame, if Sony has a monopoly, you don't 'honestly' think they won't do what Nintendo has done with the handheld market and Microsoft with the PC software market... :rolleyes:

If Sony has a monopoly, it wont be any different from nintendo's (handheld), or Microsoft's (software).

I'm not even goint to think of picking which company I would rather have run a monopoly on the games market.

If there is a monopoly, expect higher priced consoles, software, and fewer technical jumps.

Oh, and I know you said you woudn't want any type of monopoly, but just stop and think, Sony wouldn't be doing what it is now.

[Perfect Stu]

Originally posted by PuPPeT
Now I’m not saying every PS2 owner is that brain washed I’m just saying over here at lest 60 to 70% of them are.

Show me some proof.

Originally posted by TheGame
You must have bought that Ps2 for it's "cool" factor huh? If GCN is cheaper and better, why not buy one?

:rofl:

I was about to say the same thing. It's so true...

I'm sorry PuPPeT, but if your opinion is all you have, you've made a pretty pathetic attempt at proving that 60-70% of PS2's sales are due to brainwashed people who buy the PS2 cause it's 'kool'

:lol:

NEXT!

[TheGame]

Originally posted by Shadow_Link
TheGame, if Sony has a monopoly, you don't 'honestly' think they won't do what Nintendo has done with the handheld market and Microsoft with the PC software market... :rolleyes:

If Sony has a monopoly, it wont be any different from nintendo's (handheld), or Microsoft's (software).

I'm not even goint to think of picking which company I would rather have run a monopoly on the games market.

If there is a monopoly, expect higher priced consoles, software, and fewer technical jumps.

Oh, and I know you said you woudn't want any type of monopoly, but just stop and think, Sony wouldn't be doing what it is now.

Did i say that it would be good for Sony to have one? NO

A Monopoly would suck whoever had one... Nintendo has already proven to me that they can't handle one by going in the wrong direction with thier games.

Look at GCN, the comeback effort isn't even that great...

Keep in mind who's talking here... TheGame... BigJustinW... My favorite genre is sports games!!!

If Nintendo Gamecube were the only system, Madden, NBA 2k2, NBA Live 2002, and NFL 2k2 would all be ****ed. Online gaming would also be ****ed... That's why I wouldn't want Nintendo on top.

For anybody else, it may be great, but when it messes up my favorite genre of games that's where the line is drawn.

[Xantar]

What's happening again, TheGame? Did you agree with me or something?

Well, sports games suck, and I avoid them as much as possible. There, that ought to fix things. :D

[bobcat]

Originally posted by Xantar
What's happening again, TheGame? Did you agree with me or something?

Well, sports games suck, and I avoid them as much as possible. There, that ought to fix things. :D

The only sports game I like is Winning Eleven (or ISS).

Others don't interest me.

[fingersman]

Well Nintendo had monopoly in the Nes days and games where priced nicely and they had some of the best games ever. ( duh)
Oh man Nes days bring back some memories.

In fact my friend has a Nes by him......with like about 15-20 games.....I'm going up there later today and play it till my brains rot. MUHAHHAHAHAHHAhA.


BTW.....I think it's really hard for companies that make consoles to make a comeback in this industry. In fact I don't think there has ever been a company that has made a real big comeback ( if they make a comeback at all) in the videogame industry.

So with that said..I think Nintendo is doing ok.....not great but considering the competition this time around I think they can hold thier own.


I know it's a little off topic and it looks like if I'm hoping from one point to the next...but hey I just woke up gimme a break.