Rumor: Leaked minutes from Sega/Sony meeting reveal PS2 and Dreamcast on PSN, much mo

[RagedHybrid]

Okay, buckle up -- there's a whole lot to take in here. As discovered by French site Objectif-SEGA, Sega's public relations FTP site recently got a titillating addition: The alleged minutes from an August 5 meeting between the Hedgehog-centric publisher and Sony Computer Entertainment America. (The document is reproduced in its entirety after the break.)

The biggest, potential news from this document concerns SCEA's general plans for the future. One excerpt from the minutes lists a Spring 2010 launch window for the PlayStation Motion Controller -- specifically March for Japan. Another noteworthy section mentions a "PS2 emulator for PS3," claiming that "SCEA wants to sell all PS2 titles on PSN." Later in the document, the possibility of Dreamcast titles on PSN is also suggested, in addition to a "Japanese Import" section.

This leak has an air of credibility due to its appearance on Sega's public FTP media resource center -- however, it's entirely possible that it could have been uploaded to said FTP site by a hack-savvy Dreamcast enthusiast. Maintain your skepticism as you browse the full document.

Alleged official meeting notes:

SCEA Meeting Aug 5th Notes
Aug 6 2009 – DRAFT FOR COMMENTS

Objectives of Meeting

* Dyer agreed to regular quarterly meetings with SOA

Sony PS3

* SCEA reiterated plans to sell 13 million PS3s this year
* Big announcement back half of year they can't talk about (potentially price cut of PS3 to reach hardware goals)
* SCEA commented on indexing between PS3 and 360 SKUs, should be around 2:1 to garner most favorable treatment.

Motion Controller

* Spring 2010 launch (March in JP)
* No bundle/pricing details yet, should come Sept 1
* Plan on selling 4-5MM units WW
* SCEA agreed to provide a list of Sega IP that would work well with the motion controller, Virtua Tennis was an example
* Motion Controller support allows easy way to differentiate PS3 SKU
* Other differentiation opportunities include PSP/PS3 interoperability – think of features that would make users want to buy both PS3 and PSP SKUs.

Alpha Protocol

* Michael Foster, product evaluator, said AP felt barely RPG. Initial level too challenging for players. "Mass Effect felt more RPG."
* Review notes sent to John Merlino a few weeks prior. After meeting Gerald mentioned AP is a high priority for his team.

Planet 51

* Sell in of PS3 SKU – SCEA noted that other movie titles on PS3 had underperformed as well (inc. Transformers) this cycle.
* Dyer suggests contacting Susan at Walmart and asking what she wants in the pack to sell this SKU (movie tix etc)
* Other possibilities are Hybrid movie disc (BD 25 or 50 with Game and Movie on same disc).

Bayonetta

* Collectors edition with Bayonetta Action Figure
* Novo recommended launching PSN demo around Xmas based off a Jan 5th Ship date with 2-3 week run out to launch.
* 3-4 weeks is usually ideal demo timing with fresh content every week leading up to launch (trailers, insider video about PG heritage, video blogs).

Vancouver 2010

* HOME, Olympic destination would garner a lot of positive attention from SCEA
* Should be doing same with Bayonetta, Marvel etc. Easy to launch in all territories.
* HOME merchandizing opportunities (clothes etc).

Sonic Racing

* Open to DLC to differentiate PS3 SKU – not ratchet and clank but other characters
* maybe characters from Rare or Fable universes

Yakuza

* Could put Japanese games directly on PSN for download in a special Japanese Import section (pricing $9.99 to $39.99 for full game).
* Might need to localize menus at least with subtitles.
* SCEA interested in helping on MKTG side if they can have period of exclusivity.

AVP

* Another great HOME candidate
* AVP avatars
* Hybrid BD disc with movie

Iron Man 2

* Great candidate for HOME space – explore Tony Stark's lab etc.
* Should have one for Marvel in general.

PSU2

* Could do bundle at GameStop with PSP 30-35K units on UMD, Go, or both.

Valkyria 1937

* Could bundle with PSP as well.

Vanquish and Aliens: CM

* Opportunity for PS3/PSP interoperability (see Eidos Batman, Army of Two, Assassin's Creed for good examples).
* If we offer that SCEA would be really interested in having us at their booth next E3.

Thor

* SCEA would like a look at the code soon.

Sonic Anniversary

* Could put out collectors edition with all old sonic games on one BD disc.
* "Best of Sonic" for around $99.
* SCEA would love PSN exclusive power ups/different game modes (like Castlevania's flip it over/backwards)

PS2 emulator for PS3 (confidential)

* SCEA wants to sell all PS2 titles on PSN (GTA Vice City/Sonic/etc)
* For co Marketing money show PS3 controller on TV ads – similar to EA Madden Spots, NCAA, etc...

London Olympics

* Perfect opportunity for Motion Controller integration.

DC Digital Titles

* If we provide a list of DC titles SCEA will let us know which ones they're interested in having exclusively.
* If we give them a long period of exclusivity they'll give us more marketing support.

PSP Titles

* For SKU differentiation it's best to offer features that are slightly different from PS3 version.
* Titles that are coming up on PSP are Assassin's Creed II, GTA China Wars, Resident Evil, Little Big Planet – all massive franchises.
* SCEA has a specific PSP deck which they can send up with their hardware director for a chat.


Source (http://www.joystiq.com/2009/09/22/rumor-leaked-minutes-from-sega-sony-meeting-reveal-ps2-and-drea/)

[Angrist]

Would be nice to be able to play the Dreamcast games.

Makes me wonder why Nintendo doesn't hurry up and release more N64 games.

[Bube]

I'd probably buy both the PS2 and DC emulation stuff immediately :)

Especially the PS2 emulator. PS2 games are so cheap these days, and there are some really good games out. It'd be nice playing them through an HD setup..

Edit: Wait a minute.. They say PS2 emulator, but then say that they want to sell PS2 games over PSN. Why can't we just download an emulator and play the games we already own?

[manasecret]

I'd probably buy both the PS2 and DC emulation stuff immediately :)

Especially the PS2 emulator. PS2 games are so cheap these days, and there are some really good games out. It'd be nice playing them through an HD setup..

Edit: Wait a minute.. They say PS2 emulator, but then say that they want to sell PS2 games over PSN. Why can't we just download an emulator and play the games we already own?

Interesting point about emulating games you already own... if they did it right, they would let you just stick in any PS2 and Dreamcast games you already own, as well as let you download games from PSN.

[magus113]

Yeah the wording on that seems really strange. A little too strange.

[TheGame]

Interesting point about emulating games you already own... if they did it right, they would let you just stick in any PS2 and Dreamcast games you already own, as well as let you download games from PSN.

But what would make more money for Sony? Letting you play your old games, or having you buy them again? :P

I just hope they expand on the Psx lineup a lot, I want to get some of the games I can no longer find in stores. Mainly Xenogears and Suikoden 2.

[TheSlyMoogle]

Either way if done right this could be huge for Sony really.

[Angrist]

But what would make more money for Sony? Letting you play your old games, or having you buy them again? :PExactly. The Virtual Console doesn't let you play your cartridge-owned Nintendo games, does it?

*hums 'Oh Many', something about where the money is*

[manasecret]

But what would make more money for Sony? Letting you play your old games, or having you buy them again? :P

I just hope they expand on the Psx lineup a lot, I want to get some of the games I can no longer find in stores. Mainly Xenogears and Suikoden 2.

Doing small things and giving them away for free for good will and a larger monetary return in the longrun is underrated. See Valve and Steam and the value-packed Orange Box and all their free updates.

[TheGame]

Doing small things and giving them away for free for good will and a larger monetary return in the longrun is underrated. See Valve and Steam and the value-packed Orange Box and all their free updates.

The problem is that its a risk. I think Sony is tired of taking risks about now lol

[BreakABone]

The problem is that its a risk. I think Sony is tired of taking risks about now lol

Sony hasn't really taken any risks this generation.
Other than banking on the fact that their name brand was strong enough to sustain a 600 dollar console, and that was more arrogance than anything.

[TheGame]

Sony hasn't really taken any risks this generation.
Other than banking on the fact that their name brand was strong enough to sustain a 600 dollar console, and that was more arrogance than anything.

Nah, looking at history it was a risk. Selling the system without making a profit was a risk too.

[Thespis721]

Selling systems and making little to no profit is not a risk. It's rather common practice if your name isn't Nintendo. They idea is that they make the money off licensing and accessories. As well as just name acknowledgement.

Disney doesn't make a lot of money off tickets to their Broadway musicals. A lot of times, they lose money. But it's about market real estate then anything else.

[Bube]

Exactly. The Virtual Console doesn't let you play your cartridge-owned Nintendo games, does it?

*hums 'Oh Many', something about where the money is*
Putting cartridge slots on a Wii wouldn't be the same though :) Plus, you can play GC games on Wii :) And PS2 compatibility is something the PS3 had at launch.

They also sell PSX games over PSN, but the console is backwards-compatible for PSX games as well.

If they decided to sell the "software emulator" over PSN, then that would be good for everybody. They make money, we get (almost) what we want.

[TheGame]

Selling systems and making little to no profit is not a risk.

Losing $150+ per unit after the unit is actually sold is a big risk imo. It just happend to pay out for them more in the Ps2 era then it did in the Ps3 era.

Disney doesn't make a lot of money off tickets to their Broadway musicals. A lot of times, they lose money. But it's about market real estate then anything else.

Disney isn't just donating money. They're gambling it and hoping they turn a profit. Just because its a calculated risk doesn't mean its not a risk.

[Thespis721]

Losing $150+ per unit after the unit is actually sold is a big risk imo. It just happend to pay out for them more in the Ps2 era then it did in the Ps3 era.



Disney isn't just donating money. They're gambling it and hoping they turn a profit. Just because its a calculated risk doesn't mean its not a risk.


Disney makes money. Just because they'll probably lose money in the show's production on Broadway doesn't mean that they aren't going to make money. Same with SONY and Microsoft. They have plans to make money even if they are losing money. People have been losing money off systems since the 90s.

When the Lion King opened, they knew that the show would have to run for 10 years, selling out 110% every performance, to START to break even. People rarely make money off the show. They make money off the touring of the show, the merchendising, and the rights when other places do the show. Likewise, SONY and Microsoft lose money on the console, but they make money off the licensing of every game, accessories, and first party games, not to mention boosting Blu-Ray sales, advertising, etc, etc.

[TheGame]

Disney makes money. Just because they'll probably lose money in the show's production on Broadway doesn't mean that they aren't going to make money. Same with SONY and Microsoft. They have plans to make money even if they are losing money. People have been losing money off systems since the 90s.

When the Lion King opened, they knew that the show would have to run for 10 years, selling out 110% every performance, to START to break even. People rarely make money off the show. They make money off the touring of the show, the merchendising, and the rights when other places do the show. Likewise, SONY and Microsoft lose money on the console, but they make money off the licensing of every game, accessories, and first party games, not to mention boosting Blu-Ray sales, advertising, etc, etc.

So, you're saying.. knowing the history of the video game industry.. that Sony releasing Ps3 at $600 while losing $150+ per sale wasn't a risk? If you think that, then you're wrong, period. And that's all I'm saying. If the system doesn't sell, then everything else you you listed as sources for making money won't sell.

[BreakABone]

Hmm, well the price was a risk, but don't think for the reasons you think... anyhow.

I think Sony's biggest risk/blunder/whatever was putting as much faith in Hi-Def adaption rates as they did. I mean the price would have been a lot cheaper or cheaper somewhat without the inclusion of blu-ray, I mean sure an add-on would have been a pain, but gives the people who want it the option to shell out some money.

Granted, I assume they expected a repeat of the Ps2 where being a DVD player helped push it early on in the generation, but blu ray while awesome still hasn't caught on.

If you sell a product at a 150 dollar loss, and it is still way over the average market value for a console especially a successful one, I wouldn't consider it a risk as much as dumb business, but that's me.

[Thespis721]

My point of view is more grand scheme then individual, which is how SONY views it. Selling things at a loss is a common business practice. We see it all the time. You ever go to one of those stores, like in Times Square, and they are busy and are doing business, but given the cost of rental, there's no way they are turning a profit from the store? That's called a loss leader. It's a common business practice where you put out something, even though it individually loses you money, so that it can have an overall profitable impact. Whether that be for name recognition, value, and results in selling elsewhere.

SONY and Microsoft do the same thing when they sell their systems at a loss. You could look at it as a risk, but all business tactics have some degree of risk. But in the overall standpoint, selling at a loss is less a risk then you would think.

[TheGame]

If you sell a product at a 150 dollar loss, and it is still way over the average market value for a console especially a successful one, I wouldn't consider it a risk as much as dumb business, but that's me.

When selling something over priced, and it is sucsessful.. its a good calculated risk. When it fails to meet expectations, its a dumb buisness move and a bad risk. With that said, I agree with your outlook on it.

But either way its cut, its a risk.

Giving away anything for free or at a loss, and expecting it to pay off in the end through other means, is a risk.