Nintendo feels like a broken record

[Neo]

I like Mario games just as much as the next Nintendo fan, but this is getting ridiculous. Nintendo knows Mario sells and they milk every last drop out of the mario utter. Just when you think it's gone dry they manage to squirt you in the face with another stream of mario milk. It's seriously time for Nintendo to develop some new characters and let Mario, Samus, and Link rest for a while. I would even be happy if they released a new punch-out or kid icarus title. But honestly Nintendo needs to try their hand at new franchises if they want more than to simply hold on to their tiny piece of the pie. Pikmin was a good start but they can't be afraid to try new things. Sure some of them might fail but businesses don't grow by standing still.

Revolution needs to launch with Punch-Out, Kid Icarus, Pilotwings, and a couple other refreshing titles. Mario and Donkey Kong won't sell systems beyond the core audience.

[Bond]

You're realizing this just now? Wow... this has been Nintendo's problem for a long time now.

[Neo]

No it's just starting to piss me off now.

[DarkMaster]

And admist all their milking crap, they still haven't taken advantage of a true, 3D Pokemon RPG title on the GameCube. I guess they aren't the kind of company that likes to make $100,000,000+ on a single game.

[Perfect Stu]

I originally bought a PS2 for new franchises already established on the PSone, and a different library of games that wouldnt be on Gamecube. At the time, I still planned on buying a Gamecube.

What's pissing you off pissed ME off at that very time and Ive still never bought a Gamecube and don't plan to.

[Typhoid]

Yeah, Everyone knows they milk it all up.

But its like saying Playstation is milking up GTA, or MGS because they know it sells.

I only plan on getting my own Gamecube because of the new Zelda game coming out. Thats the only reason. Zelda games are good games.

[Jonbo298]

I agree they need more new characters. I wish they would've taken time to make an all new DS Mario game rather then re-hashing an old one and making new things in it. A new Zelda that appeals more to gamers is a start but maybe some more variety then porting and rehashing games already released.

I've still yet to see a new Mario game on the GBA that isn't a port or the RPG, etc...That's the problem with Nintendo right now. They would rather hash out old games then make new ones.

But hopefully with Revolution, a new kick ass Mario comes out at launch and a few months later a new kick ass Zelda game comes out. Launch also with a Super Smash Bros. melee game that takes full advantage of online play. Throw in a few new games within months of launch that are new characters that everyone can enjoy. Don't go the route and make violent games. There's enough as it is.

[Joeiss]

Yeah, Everyone knows they milk it all up.

But its like saying Playstation is milking up GTA, or MGS because they know it sells.

I only plan on getting my own Gamecube because of the new Zelda game coming out. Thats the only reason. Zelda games are good games.


3 MGS games spanning 7 years and 2 systems isn't milking it at all, IMO. And GTA is milked on all systems, not just the PS2.

But the thing is, these games are kick ass. And until they start sucking, I want them to release games every other years ago or so.

And Sony is on the verge of milking Jak and R&C... But I think Jak is just a trilogy, so there won't be any more for a while... And R&C is still going strong, so I want them to make more, haha.

[Blackmane]

I fully 100% agree with you, Neo. All this crap, especially Mario and Zelda crap (yes, even Zelda crap) needs to stop. Thats all it is with Nintendo anymore.

Mario Kart, Mario Tennis, Mario Golf, Mario Baseball, Zelda 4 swords garbage, Zelda Minish cap garbage (who knows if that will be good or not), heck, even Super Smash Bros. had only characters they are comfortable with like Link, Mario, DK, ect.

I am so very dissapointed with my Gamecube right now. The only new thing I truly enjoyed with Viewtiful Joe, and that wasn't from Nintendo.

[Perfect Stu]

But its like saying Playstation is milking up GTA, or MGS because they know it sells..

who is Playstation?

[Typhoid]

who is Playstation?


Haha...oops.

Obviosuly, I meant Sony. Im int he middle of writing my grad comment, so i'm not all here. I arnt all being too smrt right now.

Yes.

Smrt.

S-M-R-T.

[Perfect Stu]

well even Sony...they didnt make GTA3, Vice City, San Andreas, MGS2 or MGS3

you would have to pin that on Rockstar and Konami, they're the ones profiting most from those titles.

And even THEN...I wouldnt call it milking. I'll say Vice City was more of a cash-project more than anything, but GTA3 and San Andreas, not so much.

[Stonecutter]

And admist all their milking crap, they still haven't taken advantage of a true, 3D Pokemon RPG title on the GameCube. I guess they aren't the kind of company that likes to make $100,000,000+ on a single game.

I think that ship has sailed. Pokemon isn't nearly as popular as it was like 3 or 4 years ago.

It was downright retarded when they didn't release a 3D Pokemon RPG on N64.

I originally bought a PS2 for new franchises already established on the PSone, and a different library of games that wouldnt be on Gamecube. At the time, I still planned on buying a Gamecube.

What's pissing you off pissed ME off at that very time and Ive still never bought a Gamecube and don't plan to.

If it wasn't for Metroid Prime I doubt I'd have kept my gamecube. I bought it origionally because of Rogue Squardron II because RS1 was one of my favorite games ever. It was fantastic for a launch title, but I'll probably never play it again. Super Monkey Ball is an ALL TIME classic, but I could live without it too.

[thatmariolover]

Meh. It's always been this way, and yeah I'm frustrated by it. And yeah, I think Nintendo needs to branch out. However, I also like Link, and Mario, and Samus. I mean, I understand that you guys want something new. But When it comes to those titles, I've not disliked one of them. Yeah, they hit me with them a million times, but I still keep buying them and I still keep enjoying them. So I'm not going to bitch. Nintendo needs more 3'rd and 2'nd party support to pick up the slack while they still do what they do.

In all reality, I think people forget that Nintendo is a software company as well as a hardware company. And if you think of it objectively like that, they come out with as many new games that aren't based off of previous franchises as any other software developer. Which is to say, not very often. Capcom will always do Resident Evil, Konami will always do Silent Hill and Resident Evil, and Nintendo is always going to do Mario and Zelda. And I am still going to buy their stuff as long as I enjoy it.

Zelda Minish cap garbage (who knows if that will be good or not)

I wish I could slap you. Not really, but I just want to emphasize how serious I am when I say that Minish Cap is incredible. I've been playing through the leaked ROM (oh God don't flame me, please) and it's absolutely incredible. I can't get enough of it. I fully intend to purchase the game when it is officially released.

[TheGame]

Nintendo should keep Mario a platformer, and Zelda a 3D RPGish game ;) I don't mind getting a lot of the TRUE games in the series' because they are all good, but slapping Mario and Link's name on every title that comes out for marketing purposes is annoying.

-EDIT-

And changing up an already perfect formula is annoying too. Some of us just want more of the same. Improve the gameplay, but don't change how the game is played. (if that makes any sense... think Mario 64 vs Mario Sunshine)

[GameMaster]

The same characters returning over and over doesn't bother me. Same ideas bother me though. Like instead of laying a Mario Party egg every year, Nintendo should wait a while in between and develop something new and fresh. Same could be said for Pokemon too I think. The transition from RBY, GSC, RS, FR & LG moves quite fast when you put it on a timeline. For fans, it couldn't have come any sooner, but in the long run, it would be better to spend more time developing and creating new ideas and concepts for the characters. I don't think there's any problem with the Gamecube Metroid, Mario, and Zelda installments thus far. Each game brought something new to it's characters. Mario still has to save the princess, but the idea was fresh in that he was framed by his shadow form and led the town to believe he trashed their city. So he has to clean and collect shines to get things back in order. And instead of the normal Mario arsenal, he primarily relies on a unique water pack. Metroid's new concept is obvious: 3D environment and navigation. It was never played that way before. Zelda's obvious change was the appearance. But aside from that was primary ocean/water based adventure with the incorporation of wind and the ability to control it. Link still has his old weapons and everything but in my opinion, there was enough change to warrant as a new fresh game. Now of course, Nintendo has reused some ideas too much as the two mentioned earlier as well as maybe the Mario sport titles. I think for some it's just an opinion based. Something else to consider is perhaps the problem might be that you've grown and your tastes have changed since the orignal Marios, Zeldas, and Metroids were released. Because many people still enjoy these games and are enjoying the Gamecube just as much as it's predecessor.

[Ginkasa]

Meh. It's always been this way, and yeah I'm frustrated by it. And yeah, I think Nintendo needs to branch out. However, I also like Link, and Mario, and Samus. I mean, I understand that you guys want something new. But When it comes to those titles, I've not disliked one of them. Yeah, they hit me with them a million times, but I still keep buying them and I still keep enjoying them. So I'm not going to bitch. Nintendo needs more 3'rd and 2'nd party support to pick up the slack while they still do what they do.

In all reality, I think people forget that Nintendo is a software company as well as a hardware company. And if you think of it objectively like that, they come out with as many new games that aren't based off of previous franchises as any other software developer. Which is to say, not very often. Capcom will always do Resident Evil, Konami will always do Silent Hill and Resident Evil, and Nintendo is always going to do Mario and Zelda. And I am still going to buy their stuff as long as I enjoy it.


I completely agree. Every developer has their key titles and franchises that gain sequel after sequel. I mean, Capcom is more guilty of the crimes you guys are blaming Nintendo for. Sure, they may have more franchises, but they also milk those individual franchises far more than Nintendo milks their's.

The only difference between Nintendo and Capcom (or Nintendo and any 3rd party developer) would be that Nintendo also is the company behind a console that has very little 3rd party support. Most of the titles on the GCN are actually made by Nintendo. Thus, most of the games are going to be Mario, Zelda, or Samus.

With the PS2 or XBox, any one first or second party game has 10 third party games backing it up. With so much variety, its easier to ignore the lack of originality.

Nintendo is no more guilty of rehashing their franchises than any other developer; they just happened to get caught.

On another note, I, for one, don't mind them using the same franchises so long as those franchises are used well. The Metroid series has so far been better than ever; Zelda's still the greatness it has always been; and even though the Mario "series" has ceased to become a part of the platformer genre, his games are still generally good.

I can't see how anyone could call this stuff "crap."


*shrugs and walks away*

[KillerGremlin]

Yup, the Minish Cap is tight. I've been playing the Rom for a while now too.....and I'm impressed.

While Nintendo totally lost control of the 3D market with the N64, they've been doing pretty damn good with the 2D market. Personally, I think the entire gaming market is getting a little stale. There are too many sequels and not nearly enough new ideas. It's not just Nintendo that's bringing the industry down, although Nintendo seems to be trying the hardest. I would blame a lot of this on Nintendo when they became overly pompous and lost all of their 3rd party support in the Nintendo 64 days. Realistically, the N64 should have kicked the Playstation's ass. It had better graphics, a better controller, and it supported up to four people on multiplayer opposed to Sony's 2-person multiplayer. Unfortunately, Nintendo let opportunity fly out the window and they made about 47 games with Mario in them, and a load of other franchise games for the N64. I'm not saying that Mario Kart or Mario 64 or Paper Mario weren't good......but why not just Kart Racing? I was happy when Banjo Kazoie came out, because you didn't play as a major Nintendo Franchise character.

I still hold the N64 at a very high level, because there where a lot of good games for it, even if a lot of them where franchise titles. Unfortunately, Nintendo continued along the path they started treading on with the Nintendo 64. Aside from the Gamecube's fairly strong launch (Pikmin, Rogue Squadron 2, Super Smash Bros. Melee....all three KICK ASS games), Nintendo hasn't done much with the Gamecube. A few franchise titles here and there doesn't make a system or company good. The Wind Waker played out so much like Ocarina of Time, even if it had a good story the gameplay was so ridiculously similar to Ocarina you had to be wondering what Nintendo was doing with your 50 dollars. Mario Sunshine was basically Mario 64 - shines, not stars. What a huge difference there - and even if Mario had a waterpack, the effect of it wore off quickly and the end result felt very gimmicky. Especially considering that Mario 64 was a much more fun game.

Nintendo has failed to capitalize off the Gamecube. They have neglected to go online. With their new console on the horizon, one wonders if Nintendo WILL take the Gamecube online. I don't want to be skeptic, but with the amount of effort Nintendo has put forth so far to take the Gamecube online, it seems doubtful that they will get it online in the next year or two. Nintendo continues to push 3rd party developers farther away with the Gamecube, offering nothing better then its Sony or Microsoft counterpart. And even though Nintendo fans have begun to complain more openly about Nintendo's tactics, Nintendo is still on the loose releasing silly, unnecessary, and ultimately useless peripherals like the E-card Reader and the hookup to connect your GBA to your Gamecube.

And Nintendo still says that they are about the gaming, they are about the fans. That's obviously bullsh*t, especially because that was the argument used as an excuse when Nintendo announced they weren’t going online. Ouch Nintendo, that hurts.

On the other had, Nintendo has had a stroke of luck with the handheld market. The Game Boy Advance was a remarkable little system, with great gaming and graphics. And while it didn't push any graphic envelopes, it provided enough colors and pixels to bring SNES games to life again - something that I was very happy to be part of. The thing is, 3D gaming just doesn't seem as fun, in retrospect, to its 2D gaming counterpart. 2D gaming just plain kicks ass, in my opinion. The 2D Zelda games, the 2D Castlevania games, the 2D Mario games - they all beat the hell out of the majority of the 3D games on the market right now. Unfortunately, with the DS and the PSP out, we might as well kiss 2D gaming goodbye, once the portable market makes the shift to 3D. It's going to be a sad time when playing SNES games will only be possible through emulation, or hooking up your SNES.

Nintendo is on the edge of insanity. Their fans are smelling the weakness, and people are starting to realize that Nintendo just isn't what it used to be anymore. I don't know if that will directly affect the Nintendo DS, but I do know that it will affect Nintendo's next console unless Nintendo pulls its sh*t together and starts releasing original titles, and stops sucking off their franchises.

[DarkMaster]

No one ever said Capcom doesn't milk their franchises. They are THE worst company when it comes to rehashes, it's almost laughable now. But there is considerably more pressure on Nintendo to come up with fresh ideas than Capcom. They have a console that relies mainly on the success of first party titles.

[Blackmane]

Maybe I should clarify that I like the original uses of all the characters. I like them in their own game. THe thing I hate is all the franchise gimmicks that are supposed to be revolutionary games like all the Mario sports games. The only gimmick that wasn't a horrible one was Super Smash Bros. (which is a great game, IMO)

Nintendo needs to stop wearing out their franchises (ESPECIALLY Mario) with useless and gimmicky sports titles and variety games and come up with new ideas, freshen up older, less known franchises, and keep the fire on their popular franchises.

[Stonecutter]

I'm sure a lot of people have said this, but PSP will be the end of Nintendo's handheld dominance. I'm not going to claim that it will be better or worse than the DS, but Sony is not going to turn out crap and it's going to sell. Nintendo will still be a player (Playa Playa) but it can kiss its 99% of the market share goodbye within 18 months.

[Jonbo298]

It's a given fact that Nintendo won't keep their share of the handheld market. I think everyone knows that by now ;)

But I think Nintendo shouldn't waste the effort to get the Gamecube online. Put all the work into Revolution and getting an online mode from the start. Tell developers how to use it and make good games to go with it. Use the new console to turn from the mistakes made this gen.

[Canyarion]

Zelda Minish cap garbage (who knows if that will be good or not)
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :wtf:

Beside the fact that it's a GREAT game, it's just another sequel in the Zelda series!!

Anyway, is anyone here interested in a special edition golden Triforce AGB SP???? My brother wants to buy The Minish Cap, but without the golden SP. We could send it to you, since it's not coming out in the States.

[gekko]

They have before, many times. But even if they try new things, unless it's a mainstream game, it won't be bought up anyway. Sega was well known for their quirky titles, but they sold only to a few select Sega fans willing to play strange games like Seaman, and Ooga Booga. Look what happened when they went multi-platform, they could only sell Virtua Fighter games.

Even look at most of you, how quick were you to embrace Donkey Konga? I preached it for months and nobody cared. In order for it to be a strong financial move, people need to be willing to try these other titles. If the majority of gamers are going to just blow it off, then it's a waste of money, no matter how great the game is.

[KillerGremlin]

I'm sure a lot of people have said this, but PSP will be the end of Nintendo's handheld dominance. I'm not going to claim that it will be better or worse than the DS, but Sony is not going to turn out crap and it's going to sell. Nintendo will still be a player (Playa Playa) but it can kiss its 99% of the market share goodbye within 18 months.

That's a fairly brave claim, considering that Nintendo has the majority of the handheld market right now, and the DS already has a jump on the PSP. I'm not saying that Sony has no chance, but with the amount of games in development for the DS, compared to the select few titles that aren't ports or don't look bad on the PSP, I'd say that Nintendo is going to hold onto the market for a while. The PSP is graphically superior, but it's going to be much much more expensive any way you slice it. I think the PSP will take over some of the portable market, but it certainly won't knock Nintendo off the map.

[Null]

That's a fairly brave claim, considering that Nintendo has the majority of the handheld market right now, and the DS already has a jump on the PSP. I'm not saying that Sony has no chance, but with the amount of games in development for the DS, compared to the select few titles that aren't ports or don't look bad on the PSP, I'd say that Nintendo is going to hold onto the market for a while. The PSP is graphically superior, but it's going to be much much more expensive any way you slice it. I think the PSP will take over some of the portable market, but it certainly won't knock Nintendo off the map.

Who said it will knock nintendo off the map? he's saying nintendo can kiss its 99% hold of the market goodbye.
Meaning if sony only takes 10%, then nintendos down to 89% and just kissed its 99% goodbye. lol you said yourself sony will take some of the market, so you just proven the point for him.
no ones saying nintendo will get booted off the map. i dont think anyone actually believes that no matter who they think will win that race.

and both DS and PSP have some ports on em. you underestimate the range of games being made on PSP, and as it gets closer to launch, more games are being announced and more developers are signing on.

and im sorry, but $50 isnt much much more expensive. :p id say thats an unbelievably competitive price from sony.

I'm not saying which is better, im just arguing a few points for the sake of arguing. lol. :)

[Canyarion]

but it can kiss its 99% of the market share goodbye within 18 months.That's quite an understatement then. I think Nintendo has ALREADY lost 5% of the market. Sony doesn't need 18 months to do that. :p

Anyway, Nintendo needs new franchises, that's a given.

[KillerGremlin]

Who said it will knock nintendo off the map? he's saying nintendo can kiss its 99% hold of the market goodbye.
Meaning if sony only takes 10%, then nintendos down to 89% and just kissed its 99% goodbye. lol you said yourself sony will take some of the market, so you just proven the point for him.
no ones saying nintendo will get booted off the map. i dont think anyone actually believes that no matter who they think will win that race.

and both DS and PSP have some ports on em. you underestimate the range of games being made on PSP, and as it gets closer to launch, more games are being announced and more developers are signing on.

and im sorry, but $50 isnt much much more expensive. :p id say thats an unbelievably competitive price from sony.

I'm not saying which is better, im just arguing a few points for the sake of arguing. lol. :)

Aye, my bad reading that.

The PSP is a good price, compared to what people thought it would originally be, but we still have to see how much memory and games are going to be.

I think the potential for the PSP is through the roof, and I'm probably going to get it eventually.

[Stonecutter]

That's quite an understatement then. I think Nintendo has ALREADY lost 5% of the market.

Ummm... to what? NGage?

I have a very, very hard time believing that thing has 5%

[thatmariolover]

Ummm... to what? NGage?

I have a very, very hard time believing that thing has 5%

NGage, Cell-Phones, Tapwave Zodiac, and GP32 have all taken a bite out of Nintendo's hold in the handheld market.

[DarkMaster]

The NGage still exists? Well what do you know.

[Blackmane]

Yea, supposedly its now "better than ever" or at least that's what they are saying about the new version.

Bleh, garbage.

[Vampyr]

This three page thread popped up so amazingly quickly. I've never seen anythign like it. o_O

Despite the fact that Nintendo is a broken record, I don't think that is what is hurting their sales the most. What is tearing them apart at the foundation is their inability to break from tradition. (I guess that's almost the same thing, though, isn't it?) What I mean is that most of their games are still keeping that quality of play that all of us enjoyed as children. They do have the occasional violent game, most of them still keep that "kiddie" quality that has given them such a bad image.

The name "nintendo" is now something kids are embarrased to say they are a part of. When a new system hits stores, what are people going to want to be seen with? A "nintendo" DS, or a "Sony" PSP? No matter how cool the Nintendo system is, the name Sony sells.

[Joeiss]

Yes, I always make fun of people when they say that they own a GCN. I say "nice purse, you pansy!" Then I skip away like a 7 year old girl.















Anyways, Nintendo is still cool. Hell, I think they can definitely pull it around on their next consoles, but only time will tell.

[Jonbo298]

Well, the 10-14 year olds who think they are black, listen to rap music, demean women, would say that ;)

[The Duggler]

If you don't like it, don't play it and shut up about it.

Nintendo is perfect the way it is.

Back off.

[DarkMaster]

Nintendo is perfect the way it is.
Nope. If they were perfect there wouldn't be a 3 page thread of people complaining about them.

[The Germanator]

I don't really care how much Nintendo falls off the map. If there is a new Zelda (or Mario, Metroid, etc) game to be played on a new system that I don't have...I MUST have the system and the game, it's as simple as that. The games and tradition and nostalgia for me are reasons enough to keep playing and buying Nintendo systems. It will forever continue that way unless Mario games start to suck, and I really don't see that happening.

Edit: And don't get me wrong either. I also own both an Xbox and PS2 which I also enjoy very much. I still have never gotten into online console gaming however (except a couple of sessions on the DC), so that has never been a big deal to me at all.

[Perfect Stu]

NGage, Cell-Phones, Tapwave Zodiac, and GP32 have all taken a bite out of Nintendo's hold in the handheld market.

CELL PHONES?

um...if cell phones counted, THEY would control 99% of the handheld market

[Joeiss]

If you don't like it, don't play it and shut up about it.

Nintendo is perfect the way it is.

Back off.


We will never shut up and never back off until Nintendo becomes perfect.

[Stonecutter]

Well, the 10-14 year olds who think they are black, listen to rap music, demean women, would say that ;)

Sadly that doesn't end at 14.

[Stonecutter]

CELL PHONES?

um...if cell phones counted, THEY would control 99% of the handheld market

I was going to make that point but I figured it was redundant relative to absurd obviousness.

[thatmariolover]

Come on now guys. I thought it was absurdly obvious that I meant cell-phones that are designed with gaming in mind. If you compare those select models and the amount their producers and software developers are making off of the software, then no, they're not actually holding a rediculous amount of the market at all.

[The Duggler]

We will never shut up and never back off until Nintendo becomes perfect.

Well, have fun crying about it then. Because it will never be perfect to everybody.

Nintendo has been Nintendo for what now? At least 20 years? Why should they change?

[Canyarion]

Ummm... to what? NGage?

I have a very, very hard time believing that thing has 5%
Actually I was thinking about PSP preorders.

Although... that's probably not 5%... 20,000 compared to several millions AGBs. :p
What I mean is that Nintendo is definately going to lose that 99%, no question about it.

[DarkMaster]

Nintendo has been Nintendo for what now? At least 20 years? Why should they change?
Because they're the same god damn thing that they always were?

Those who do not evolve get left behind.

[Joeiss]

Well, have fun crying about it then. Because it will never be perfect to everybody.

Nintendo has been Nintendo for what now? At least 20 years? Why should they change?


I hope you know that I haven't taken any of this thread seriously, lol. I'm just having fun, you stupid Nintendo Lover.

[Canyarion]

Now now, be nice to eachother.

I think that Nintendo HAS changed. From a company with VERY innovative ideas into a company with SOME innovative ideas crammed into sequels.

[Joeiss]

I was joking, like I always am.

You stupid Nintendo Lover, you.